Adwords takeover - How I think it is done

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Diorex

Diorex

Chasing the long tail
Dec 7, 2006
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By now, I guess most people have heard of guys doing the Google takeover where they have every single ad on a page for Ringtones etc.

People wonder how the guy is doing it and I think I have a line on it.

Setting up a Google account is pretty straightforward and can probably be scripted. Using unique IP's is not rocket science, to keep the accounts from being traced etc.

So how can he afford to take over top spots that might be running a few dollars or more per click?

The answer is he is probably getting amazing leverage on his money.

I checked 5 different Google accounts credit card charge histories. All 5 were charged $5 to open the account and then charged between $50 and $80 for the 2nd charge of clicks, then the 3rd charge was typically in the $500-$800 range. This assumes a very high spend rate of a few thousand on day 1 - so lower spenders probably see a different pattern.

So if I was devious - and no this was not me, the only reason I gave it any thought is that it happened in one of my main verticals last night... - I would go to Wal-Mart and buy 20 - $100 Visa pre-paid credit cards.

Then I would use each card on a different account and let google hit me for the first 2 charges - which is almost always going to be for under $100. I then let the ads run at full blast and let the account get shut off for non-payment, but not until I got $500+ in free clicks.

So for an investment of $100 I get maybe $600 or more in "free" clicks, which means I dont really care what the conversion rate or CPC is since at an 85% discount I am almost always going to come out way ahead.

I suspect that Azoogle knows exactly who it is and probably has a pretty good idea of what he is doing, since that is who is paying the guy and that Google will probably come down on them pretty hard once it figures out how much this has cost them.

The reason for the spammy stuff is that they are burning URL's when they do it and might as well burn a URL and make a few grand as opposed to making a few hundred for buring it, better return on the investment. Google is not terribly picky about checking URLs just that they look almost the same is enough to get through the editorial process 99% of the time.

Google is just unorganized enough and is making so much money that they probably are not yet wise to it since it might only be a few grand a day in losses for them, which is a rounding error.
 


You got a better theory dipshit?

Sounds like a good one to me. I hadn't posted about it, but that's basically what I was thinking too. I'm pretty sure the guy with the ringtones ads isn't planning on footing the entire bill for those campaigns.
 
Buying stolen credit card could also work. Stolen credit card is cheap in the market right now (less than $30). I can probably outbid him by doing this scammy stuff, but it will just get Google to make stricter rules. So in the end, we all lose.
 
DirSP said:
Buying stolen credit card could also work. Stolen credit card is cheap in the market right now (less than $30). I can probably outbid him by doing this scammy stuff, but it will just get Google to make stricter rules. So in the end, we all lose.
Click to expand...

I thought about stolen credit cards first. This seems to me to carry more risk of prosecution and could get the FBI or another law enforcement bureau to track you down since ID theft and stuff along these lines is a higher priority. If you want to get paid Azoogle will have a bank account and other records, this makes it a little harder and a little riskier...

The way I outlined is taking advantage of Google and their credit policy. It is unlikley that a bad debt (essentially what this is) would turn into a federal case, even though it may still be fraud.

I never meant to imply that this is 100% how they were doing, just how I might go about doing it if I was so inclined... More of a theory than anything else.
 
People have been using Adwords vouchers for multiple accounts for years now, which too is abusing their system. Why hasn't Google done anything about voucher abuse? Also, double serving has been going on for years with Adwords and pracitically any keyword you could find will have advertisers breaking the double serving policy.

It seems that this person has adopted all the ways to get around Google and is just taking it further than most would. Abuse is abuse, but if Google was serious about cleaning up their search results, they should have addressed these issues a long time ago.
 
I agree with most parts of your theory except for the part about domain names.

He is not actually burning real domains. If you look at Google search results for "ringtones" right now, there are 5-6 ads with different variations of [SIZE=-1]PlayRingtonesOffer.com in the URL. The thing is that the [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]PlayRingtonesOffer.com has never been registered and the domain name is still available.

Also, if you click on the link, you will see that it goes straight to azjmp.com (Azoogle's tracking URL) - it doesn't pass through any other redirects.

The part which I don't understand is why Google doesn't just block azjmp.com links.
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Diorex said:
I thought about stolen credit cards first. This seems to me to carry more risk of prosecution and could get the FBI or another law enforcement bureau to track you down since ID theft and stuff along these lines is a higher priority. If you want to get paid Azoogle will have a bank account and other records, this makes it a little harder and a little riskier...

The way I outlined is taking advantage of Google and their credit policy. It is unlikley that a bad debt (essentially what this is) would turn into a federal case, even though it may still be fraud.

I never meant to imply that this is 100% how they were doing, just how I might go about doing it if I was so inclined... More of a theory than anything else.
Click to expand...

Most of the people (network) who stole the credit card information are from China and Russia. After different level of reselling, the information is used by people all over the world. FBI can't track down all these end users. Their only option is to crack down on those who stole the information.

There are a lot of ways to prevent these fraud but it takes time for Google to learn.
 
After some thought that does indeed seem like the most reasonable explanation. Back when Facebook was retarded and didn't bill you for 3 months, you could rake up $10,000 on a $20 pre-paid Visa.
 
Diorex said:
Then I would use each card on a different account and let google hit me for the first 2 charges - which is almost always going to be for under $100. I then let the ads run at full blast and let the account get shut off for non-payment, but not until I got $500+ in free clicks.
Click to expand...
I don't know about brand new accounts, but for established accounts Google will typically keep running ads up to 24 hours (maybe more?) after a failed transaction or two on a credit card -- even as the campaigns accumulate thousands of dollars of clicks. So he may be able to get a lot more than $500 out of one $100 pre-paid card.
 
Google Billing

Here is an example of the Google billing Method.

From Google,

For example, let's say that advertiser Alan opens an AdWords account
and starts accruing costs on Oct. 1:

On Oct. 5, Alan reaches his initial billing threshold of US$50. At
that time, we charge him for the amount accrued (which might be in
slight excess of the billing threshold if he accrued costs quickly).
Alan's billing threshold is increased to US$200. A new billing cycle
begins.
On Oct. 25, Alan again reaches his billing threshold of US$200,
triggering AdWords to charge him for costs accrued. Google again
raises his billing threshold to US$350, and initiates a new billing
cycle.
On Nov. 18, Alan accrues more than US$350 in charges. Google bills him
and raises his billing threshold to US$500.
Alan's next bill will be processed on Dec. 18 or when he exceeds the
final US$500 billing threshold - whichever comes first.
 
DirSP said:
Buying stolen credit card could also work. Stolen credit card is cheap in the market right now (less than $30). I can probably outbid him by doing this scammy stuff, but it will just get Google to make stricter rules. So in the end, we all lose.
Click to expand...

At $30, you're getting ripped off. CCs go for about 50 cents a pop. For $30, you can get a powerseller ebay account along with the paypal information and maybe even the victim's SSN/DOB.
 
the part that concerns me on this is that I see the possibility for so many different variants on a theme. since there is clearly some heavy automation going on, he/she will ride through the nices that are profitable.

Only two ways for google to really get after this is to
1) either change up the credit card policy, requiring some sort of verfication charges before making charges
2) start charging the card more aggresively (every few hours)
3) sue the hell out of the networks

I am really suprised Azoogle is not being more aggressive about this. As they can clearly tell who it is, you would think from a legal position they would do something like frezze the money transfer to the individual so the profit is really shot. IMHO if they pay him off then they will be in a seriously bad position with google that could be very hurtful long term. If the affiliate network notices this then they can take some action.

the hard part to decide is what role is it for Azoogle to insure that affiliates are compliant with the ad network rules? While they are clearly sticking it to google and/or possible credit card victims, does Azoogle have any real legal responsibility for that?
 
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