Is John McCain pro life because of - Page 3 - WickedFire - Affiliate Marketing Forum

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

^That's ridiculous you can't pick and choose. (you can't choose at all) But since you're so keen on taking over women's bodies...are you going to personally give your blessing on whether a woman has been raped or a an incident of incest? Just think about what you're proposing. There would have to be some sort of hearing or determination that that this pregnancy was a rape/incest product. With how long anything beaurocratic takes in this county that could be months. So I guess you're a big proponent of partial birth abortion then?

I can, and will, choose this November. Watch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Jeez people...I know you guys to be pretty logical in other matters on here...with this stuff like this your logic just flies out the window.

Why? Because you don't agree with it it's illogical?

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

By the way 1 in 4 women are molested/sexually assaulted at least once in their lives...I have a hard time believe that the percent of conception is 1 %. So either that number is wrong or your dealing with alot of secret rape/incest pregnancies (which I can believe) and in that case it's just another reason why women should be able to do this discretely without any further psychological and/or physical damage done them.

Planned parenthood's numbers, not mine. You do know most states require extensive record keeping and reporting by abortion clinics, right? Why don't you back your stance up and find out what the percentages are in Texas.

You're not the majority, whether you believe it or not. Most women aren't so callous as to think a life can be ended for convenience.

And as for men "not having a voice", that's the kind of mentality that will forever keep females under glass ceilings.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Unfortunately, Men who are good at this are considered good business men. Women who are good at this are just considered manipulative. :/

What a dumb fucking thing to say. First you say that you want equality, then you make excuses like that.

I'm not sure if it's penis envy or you were perped on as a kid, but playing the gender card as your last resort was pretty lame.

turbolapp · 07-21-2008, 07:09 PM

I'm not going to address most of this sillyness.

But here's a random thought for you. I will say that you may be democrat or republican and fall anywhere along this debate. However, no self respecting libertarian would ever be anti-choice, no matter your personal feelings towards the act of abortion it's self.

Since you guys loved the vagina quote so much, let me throw another favorite one at you, just for fun. I'll end this post with: If you don't like abortion, don't have one.

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by disinfect

Having an abortion before it has started to develop a brain is like cutting your nails or hair. Or removing your appendix. Simple as that. It's not a life until that, therefore abortion can never be "murder". And what it "could" develop into means nothing.

Agreed. Until the fetus is able to support itself, it is no different than a tumor basically. Using most logic that is flying around here, every time a woman has her period she is committing murder, or better yet, every time the boobs icon is used here it can be almost a guarantee that thousands of potential babies are killed.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

I'm not going to address most of this sillyness.

But here's a random thought for you. I will say that you may be democrat or republican and fall anywhere along this debate. However, no self respecting libertarian would ever be anti-choice, no matter your personal feelings towards the act of abortion it's self.

Since you guys loved the vagina quote so much, let me throw another favorite one at you, just for fun. I'll end this post with: If you don't like abortion, don't have one.

So you're not going to check the stats in Texas? Worried about what you'll find?

Anyway, if you want to end the post, no biggie. For what it's worth, some of my eBay sites should be aborted so I'm wondering what that now makes me.

turbolapp · 07-21-2008, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bb_wolfe

So you're not going to check the stats in Texas? Worried about what you'll find?

Anyway, if you want to end the post, no biggie. For what it's worth, some of my eBay sites should be aborted so I'm wondering what that now makes me.

heh. I said ending the post not the thread, I'm still here

@tweak. Your argument reminds me of the sick violenist argument from Judith Jarvis Thompson's essay: 'A Defense of Abortion' which goes like this :Suppose you awakened to find yourself hooked up through intravenous tubes to a desperately ill violinist. The violinist, you're informed, requires the shared use of your kidneys for nine months - or else he'll die. Clearly, it would be generous if you agree to continue such an arrangement. But can the state compel you to save the violinist? Certainly not. Likewise, Thompson reasons, the state cannot compel a woman to continue a pregnancy.

LotsOfZeros · 07-21-2008, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Since you guys loved the vagina quote so much, let me throw another favorite one at you, just for fun. I'll end this post with: If you don't like abortion, don't have one.

*SIGH*
Why must I keep feeling compelled to quote myself:

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

One thing I can say with conviction:
No man has ever had an abortion. (and I'm no doctor so don't even go there)

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

heh. I said ending the post not the thread, I'm still here

@tweak. Your argument reminds me of the sick violenist argument from Judith Jarvis Thompson's essay: 'A Defense of Abortion' which goes like this :Suppose you awakened to find yourself hooked up through intravenous tubes to a desperately ill violinist. The violinist, you're informed, requires the shared use of your kidneys for nine months - or else he'll die. Clearly, it would be generous if you agree to continue such an arrangement. But can the state compel you to save the violinist? Certainly not. Likewise, Thompson reasons, the state cannot compel a woman to continue a pregnancy.

Apples to oranges at best. Thompson was a critics wet dream too, not someone I'd quote too heavily as being a reputable authority on the subject.

Turbo, you're still dodging my challenge. Just name a state, I'll find the stats and show you just how right I am.

turbolapp · 07-21-2008, 09:00 PM

It's not that I'm avoiding it, I just don't care. That's a famous right wing contingency that doesn't make sense. The fallacy being that if you think that the fetus is a person that is constitutionally protected then you can't abort it under any circumstance. I personally think the fallacy comes from the fact that the right realizes that they are pushing their religious/moral beliefs on people and when faced with something as abominable as rape or incest your religious/moral convections knows no solution.

Which again is why it's better to base these arguments on clear logic instead of emotional theological beliefs.

If you're going to hold me to it though, I stand by what I said. With the number of rape and incest estimated being almost 1 in 4 there's no way that number is 1%. You're looking at reported numbers...most of this stuff goes unreported. It's not like girls are excited about announcing that daddy knocked them up.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

It's not that I'm avoiding it, I just don't care. That's a famous right wing contingency that doesn't make sense. The fallacy being that if you think that the fetus is a person that is constitutionally protected then you can't abort it under any circumstance. I personally think the fallacy comes from the fact that the right realizes that they are pushing their religious/moral beliefs on people and when faced with something as abominable as rape or incest your religious/moral convections knows no solution.

Which again is why it's better to base these arguments on clear logic instead of emotional theological beliefs.

If you're going to hold me to it though, I stand by what I said. With the number of rape and incest estimated being almost 1 in 4 there's no way that number is 1%. You're looking at reported numbers...most of this stuff goes unreported. It's not like girls are excited about announcing that daddy knocked them up.

Are you seriously saying that knowing the percentage of abortions that are simple birth control versus "dangers to the mother's life" or rape/incest doesn't matter? I think it very much matters. 1 in 4 abortions is certainly not a result of rape/incest.

Not one of my beliefs is based on theology either, not once have I claimed that they were. I agree with many Christian leaders, but their views don't drive me at all.

Are you saying a girl shouldn't report the rape/incest?

Hold tight until tomorrow, I'll get as many state's results as I can, straight from the horses mouth too.

Any woman who fails to report a rape is just as guilty as the rapist for the next rape he commits.

turbolapp · 07-21-2008, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bb_wolfe

Are you seriously saying that knowing the percentage of abortions that are simple birth control versus "dangers to the mother's life" or rape/incest doesn't matter? I think it very much matters. 1 in 4 abortions is certainly not a result of rape/incest.

Are you saying a girl shouldn't report the rape/incest?

Any woman who fails to report a rape is just as guilty as the rapist for the next rape he commits.

I certainly wouldn't blame her if she didn't.

Hmm lets turn this around cause I'm really tired of you guys not walking around in ladies shoes. (although I'm sure there are some of you out there that prefer that ,but that is another thread

) So, bb, your daddy decided he wanted to use you as a butt puppet. Your saying that you would boldly walk into a police station and announce this? Probably not. Lets say it was an acquaintance that held you down and used use a butt puppet, would you report this? Perhaps, But probably not because what would happen is everyone would know, you would be humiliated, then the police and the DA would pretty much put you on trial to prove that you didn't some how ask for it and he would most likely still get off. But hey at least you know you did the right thing, right? right.

This guy did the right thing and then he committed suicide. Saying previously:

"I shouldn't care what people think or say. It's just the fact that everyone knows I'm the kid. It was bigger than Houston. It was bigger than Texas. It was bigger than America. Everybody in the world knew what had happened and everybody knew the details of it."

2006 Texas assault incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
<sup id="cite_ref-HC0701_2-3" class="reference"></sup>

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bb_wolfe

Any woman who fails to report a rape is just as guilty as the rapist for the next rape he commits.

You should have aborted that sentence half way through, because it came out retarded. Do you have any concept of the physiological damage that rape can cause? What makes you think it's so easy? Because I'm sure everything girl thinks "I just got rapped, now let me twaddle my ass down to the station to report it" after she's just been rapped.

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 09:55 PM

Abortion: Bush Administration Memo Tries To Define Birth Control As Abortion

FTA "John McCain has yet to comment on this specific proposal, he has voted against choice 125 times in the Senate"

What a fucking ridiculous line of thought. I think Obama just found his new slogan "Obama: For those who enjoy sex"

LotsOfZeros · 07-21-2008, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

What a fucking ridiculous line of thought. I think Obama just found his new slogan "Obama: For those who enjoy sex"

I'll take the liberty of cleansing this post of liberal slantedness and rephrase for you:
"Obama: For those who enjoy sex but prefer to dodge the responsibility that comes with it"

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

I'll take the liberty of cleansing this post of liberal slantedness and rephrase for you:
"Obama: For those who enjoy sex but prefer to dodge the responsibility that comes with it"

Oh because that makes perfect sense. Obviously no conservative uses contraceptives because that's irresponsible, sure buddy.

LotsOfZeros · 07-21-2008, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

Oh because that makes perfect sense. Obviously no conservative uses contraceptives because that's irresponsible, sure buddy.

Quite the contrary, no liberal will use them because they always have abortion as their birth control - hence 'irresponsible'

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 10:09 PM

Did you even read the article?
If Bush (and possibly McCain) had his way, our only option would be abortion for birth control.

LotsOfZeros · 07-21-2008, 10:11 PM

Honestly, I mouse-hovered it and saw that it not only didn't point to a credible news source, but more than likely to a liberal propaganda blog.

I never trust the kool aid salesmen.

But I'll just take your word for it (with a grain of salt).

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Hmm lets turn this around cause I'm really tired of you guys not walking around in ladies shoes. (although I'm sure there are some of you out there that prefer that ,but that is another thread

)

You promised not to tell anyone...

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

So, bb, your daddy decided he wanted to use you as a butt puppet. Your saying that you would boldly walk into a police station and announce this? Probably not.

Would I at 6, 12, or 18? Not sure, that was lifetime ago.

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Lets say it was an acquaintance that held you down and used use a butt puppet, would you report this?

I've taken an oath to report exactly that, regardless of circumstance or degree of separation.

I think you're whole "butt puppet", funny as it is, is a huge testament to the callousness of the female urge to abort that which she finds inconvenient. So the other side of the fence deals with "pussy polo" using your logic?

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

Perhaps, But probably not because what would happen is everyone would know, you would be humiliated, then the police and the DA would pretty much put you on trial to prove that you didn't some how ask for it and he would most likely still get off. But hey at least you know you did the right thing, right? right.

I'm no expert on childhood sex crimes, but my best friend is. He's a pediatrician and aside from his family group practice, is medical director of the non-profit that does the forensic examinations and interviews of children who police suspect are victims of abuse, sexual and otherwise. According to numerous chats I've had with him over the years, no matter if the victim identifies the perp or admits anything, the same long number of years in counseling/therapy are still required for the person to cope and move past that abuse.

I'm also a mandatory reporter. I've committed to report abuse no matter what the source.

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbolapp

This guy did the right thing and then he committed suicide. Saying previously:

"I shouldn't care what people think or say. It's just the fact that everyone knows I'm the kid. It was bigger than Houston. It was bigger than Texas. It was bigger than America. Everybody in the world knew what had happened and everybody knew the details of it."

2006 Texas assault incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A depressed kid who couldn't cope isn't the gold standard for your argument. I'd fight just as hard for his rights as I would for the unborn.

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

Honestly, I mouse-hovered it and saw that it not only didn't point to a credible news source, but more than likely to a liberal propaganda blog.

I never trust the kool aid salesmen.

But I'll just take your word for it (with a grain of salt).

Fair enough. If I've learned anything, it's to take everything with a grain of salt.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

Fair enough. If I've learned anything, it's to take everything with a grain of salt.

But dude, it's on the Interwebz, it must be troo.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

You should have aborted that sentence half way through, because it came out retarded. Do you have any concept of the physiological damage that rape can cause? What makes you think it's so easy? Because I'm sure everything girl thinks "I just got rapped, now let me twaddle my ass down to the station to report it" after she's just been rapped.

Was this the perp who rapped her? I think I heard about that on the news. She said something about "Hammer don't hurt em."

.

No seriously. We consider the bartender who over-serves the guy who smashed his H2 into a van full of kids to be culpable, who is to say the women who fails to report and/or cooperate in a rape investigation isn't culpable if the rapist is able to rape again as he wasn't caught the first (or likely 10th) time. Don't say it hasn't happened. I'm even thinking there were some lawsuits in some form between women who were victims of the same rapist. (I'll research this, love that sort of shit. ((The case research, not the rapes..)))

I'm just glad I'll never get rapped, can't stand Hip Hop.

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

I'll take the liberty of cleansing this post of liberal slantedness and rephrase for you:
"Obama: For those who enjoy sex but prefer to dodge the responsibility that comes with it"

For the win...

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bb_wolfe

Was this the perp who rapped her? I think I heard about that on the news. She said something about "Hammer don't hurt em."

I'm just glad I'll never get rapped, can't stand Hip Hop.

DAMN IT! My wickedfire debating career just went out the window with that one misspelling lol.

That would be pretty horrifying though...

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

DAMN IT! My wickedfire debating career just went out the window with that one misspelling lol.

That would be pretty horrifying though...

No shit, the guy always had a posse with him. You'd be the gang bang champ of the world after that rapping.

We'll forgive you because your avatar is fucking GREAT!

tweak50 · 07-21-2008, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bb_wolfe

No seriously. We consider the bartender who over-serves the guy who smashed his H2 into a van full of kids to be culpable, who is to say the women who fails to report and/or cooperate in a rape investigation isn't culpable if the rapist is able to rape again as he wasn't caught the first (or likely 10th) time. Don't say it hasn't happened. I'm even thinking there were some lawsuits in some form between women who were victims of the same rapist. (I'll research this, love that sort of shit. ((The case research, not the rapes..)))

I'm just glad I'll never get rapped, can't stand Hip Hop.

Alright, back to the matter at hand. The scenario you describe isn't a one for one exchange though. The bartender serving drinks is both fully aware of his choices, and not the victim of the crime. Situations like these are not as black and white as you make them out to be. While it would obviously be best if the girl reported the rape, I don't think any of us can judge her for not.

Jizzlobber · 07-21-2008, 10:43 PM

Who was rapped?

bb_wolfe · 07-21-2008, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweak50

Alright, back to the matter at hand. The scenario you describe isn't a one for one exchange though. The bartender serving drinks is both fully aware of his choices, and not the victim of the crime. Situations like these are not as black and white as you make them out to be. While it would obviously be best if the girl reported the rape, I don't think any of us can judge her for not.

What if it were your wife or girlfriend who was next. Would that affect your judgment? This happens a lot more than you'd think. I'm not saying it's right that the victim be compelled to report it, I just think that in our imperfect system, the only chance we have to get anywhere close to true justice is to adopt the attitude that we're all in this together, one for all and all for one, even if it hurts the one emotionally.

Maybe the bartender example was not close enough, but here is a situation that I think is close, and happens daily...

Wives no longer have the say on whether or not they "press charges" if they're hit or abused by the husband, yet the police are mandated to charge the husband (if there's evidence) if the wife cooperates or not. Now this logic can be applied in the raped woman's favor, even under my ideas, but the opposite is also true, the woman doesn't need to consent for the police to gather as much evidence as they reasonably can, than pursue the rapist. If that means they charge the woman with failure to report a felony/crime, then so be it, assuming the crime comes to light.

We're all in this together, are we not. Why should one group suffer to protect another? Isn't that what our bill of rights, civil rights amendment, and a host of other laws are designed to do?

Why should a child suffer to protect the convenience of a woman? My position is the child shouldn't suffer. Abortion as birth control is simply wrong.

subigo · 07-22-2008, 01:05 AM

This thread just proves there should be more abortions.

LotsOfZeros · 07-22-2008, 01:06 AM

your wit astounds me

bb_wolfe · 07-22-2008, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subigo

This thread just proves there should be more abortions.

Says a basement dwelling sockfucker..

-Matt- · 07-22-2008, 04:18 PM

Bottom line is: if abortion can help stop more of these things being born into the world, then I am all for it.

(stupid rich dumbass spoiled bitch)

bb_wolfe · 07-22-2008, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Matt-

Bottom line is: if abortion can help stop more of these things being born into the world, then I am all for it.

(stupid rich dumbass spoiled bitch)

I think you just won this thread!

LotsOfZeros · 07-22-2008, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Matt-

(stupid rich dumbass spoiled bitch)

she is the joke of all jokes

HarveyJ · 07-22-2008, 11:26 PM

Seeing as we're in one of the funny interludes, before things get serious again, I've just gotta know: How long till this thread merges with the Skittles thread?
(I'm going to hell, aren't I?)

I was actually going to post a link to some Tshirthell Tshirts, but they're no longer available *sigh*

LotsOfZeros · 07-22-2008, 11:32 PM

I have a very special place in my heart for the skittles thread

tweak50 · 07-22-2008, 11:37 PM

That thread is legendary...

Jizzlobber · 07-22-2008, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

I have a very special place in my heart for the skittles thread

My heart's in my hand...and it's pumping.

-Matt- · 07-23-2008, 01:00 AM

Ah, yes, my Skittles thread. That is my legend for this forum. If I die, my thread lives on....

ldsmedia · 08-04-2008, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LotsOfZeros

WAHH! WAHH! WAHH! ..... RTF post and quit making generalizations.

So are you saying that YOU should have been aborted? I'm confused.

Just saying I wouldn't have missed any thing if I was. Who knows maybe I would have been born to someone else. Open minds see possibilities. Closed minds only see problems.

LotsOfZeros · 08-06-2008, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ldsmedia

Just saying I wouldn't have missed any thing if I was. Who knows maybe I would have been born to someone else. Open minds see possibilities. Closed minds only see problems.

and I'm saying if Thomas Edison had been aborted, we would all still be reading under candlelight

quit being so selfish

07-21-2008, 07:09 PM	#103 (permalink)
turbolapp Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Houston, TexASS Posts: 8,145 iTrader: 7 / 100%	I'm not going to address most of this sillyness. But here's a random thought for you. I will say that you may be democrat or republican and fall anywhere along this debate. However, no self respecting libertarian would ever be anti-choice, no matter your personal feelings towards the act of abortion it's self. Since you guys loved the vagina quote so much, let me throw another favorite one at you, just for fun. I'll end this post with: If you don't like abortion, don't have one. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter

07-21-2008, 09:00 PM	#109 (permalink)
turbolapp Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Houston, TexASS Posts: 8,145 iTrader: 7 / 100%	It's not that I'm avoiding it, I just don't care. That's a famous right wing contingency that doesn't make sense. The fallacy being that if you think that the fetus is a person that is constitutionally protected then you can't abort it under any circumstance. I personally think the fallacy comes from the fact that the right realizes that they are pushing their religious/moral beliefs on people and when faced with something as abominable as rape or incest your religious/moral convections knows no solution. Which again is why it's better to base these arguments on clear logic instead of emotional theological beliefs. If you're going to hold me to it though, I stand by what I said. With the number of rape and incest estimated being almost 1 in 4 there's no way that number is 1%. You're looking at reported numbers...most of this stuff goes unreported. It's not like girls are excited about announcing that daddy knocked them up. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter

07-21-2008, 10:43 PM	#127 (permalink)
Jizzlobber Moist Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 2,743 iTrader: 6 / 100%	Who was rapped? Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter __________________

07-22-2008, 01:05 AM	#129 (permalink)
subigo Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Internetland Posts: 3,787 iTrader: 15 / 100%	This thread just proves there should be more abortions. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter __________________ ZenSix Hosting - Shared hosting plans for $4.99/year.

07-22-2008, 11:26 PM	#135 (permalink)
HarveyJ He is - THE CACTUS! Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Melbourne - Not the one in Florida Posts: 3,906 iTrader: 0 / 0%	Seeing as we're in one of the funny interludes, before things get serious again, I've just gotta know: How long till this thread merges with the Skittles thread? (I'm going to hell, aren't I?) I was actually going to post a link to some Tshirthell Tshirts, but they're no longer available sigh Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter __________________ After 10,000 years I'm free!

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