Bryan Le

It was sarcastic.

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Deliguy

Trademark Searching
Conducting a Trademark Search FAQ - Yahoo! Small Business
I'm assuming you know how to read dumbshit.

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JennyAppleseed

Actually, if the other article was pure link-bait. he would have let the thread grow and grow. That was a hard thread not to touch.

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rob

I'm assuming you know how as well, but after providing a link that has nothing to do with what I said, I'm beginning to rethink that Can you provide me with a URL or search page where I can look up the "WickedFire" trademark? Since it's not listed on the TESS, maybe you can help me?

Thanks for any help.

Deliguy

hooked on phonics worked for me
Oh and heres the form
USPTO Assignments on the Web

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Stanley

Jon, you started WF to create a place for you to hang out and be yourself.
It's difficult to believe that $16 million isn't enough to convince you to hang out elsewhere.

engaged

this is ridiculous some of you idiots believe this

lerchmo

obviously you have not been reading Forum Trends, or you would know about the 3000% increase in user valuation in the webmaster niche that happened just about 1 hour ago.

rosem

sixteen million for a site that doesn't even have the .net or .org to go with it?

seriously though, if you rejected the offer because of your "loyalty", why even post/talk about it.

illusion

Because he is loyal to us users and doesn't want to keep us in the dark

sebastya

LOOOOOL

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Andrew

I think you guys are totally lowballing the value of affiliate marketers. This is an industry were the top players drive millions of dollars in commissions a year to virtually every niche and market. How valuable do you think that audience is?

lerchmo

oh, at least $5000 per registered member.

Deliguy

i'm worth about 16 dollars. better sell before i go to taco bell later.

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Simple

Dam bro, you can be a fucking millionaire. You know what that means. This has been my dreams for years and here you have a chance to have a great life with millions in the bank. I would take the offer, but if you don't, then oh well, i respect your decision.

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I_like_cock

god dammit deli! i just read your post and looked at the clock and it's 1:30. can't go get anymore beer tonight.

Anyways with this thread, I bet a lot of idiots spent all night monitoring it... just ask yourself what could you have done productively in that time.

andyt

two things -
1) I would have taken the offer in as much time as you declined it
2) I love this forum. thank you!

Deliguy

I'm spending my time tonight getting drunk and building a long range confetti gun. I regret nothing

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wickedDUDE

i'm still waiting for jon to come here with a post that says:


NOT !!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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"I need a wickedfire break."

lerchmo

that would be nice...

Jon

I just want to make it clear here..

The biggest reason I didn't sell, is because I don't need the money. Plain and simple. Had I not made my first million dollars in the adult industry many years ago, and if I were in a different position, I most likely would have sold it. But when you get to the point where cash like that is offered to you, and you already have a ton of it saved up and collecting interest, plus all of your other investments paying you every few months to a year, you start aiming a lot higher. I'm not denying that $16M is a lot of money, especially for a site with no ads on it and in it's VERY young stages. Sure I believe WF has a ton of potential over the next few years, but even if I weren't the owner, and I had that type of cash laying around to buy things like this, I wouldn't value it at $16M or even make an offer close to that much. Are they crazy? Perhaps, but they also happen to own some other properties that that overpaid for by a lot, so maybe that's just their own fault for overvaluing their investments.

Again, not saying it's not a lot, and I'm not saying that I wouldn't love to have it, but once you've passed a certain cash value point in your career, the next milestone is $50M or $100M and although hitting a cool $16M is fucking beautiful, my goal is to build this place up into something that the industry lacks, and more so into a project I finally feel a more personal attachment to. WF is more of a hobby than a cash cow for me. You can say the same thing for Shawn from Digital Point. The guy banks it pretty hard, and if someone were to offer him a sellout point, he'd probably turn that down too. Sure, a lot of people would either not believe him, not understand him, or just think he's nuts for turning it down, but the guy doesn't look at it as a cash machine, it's more of a close personal project that he will forever keep. Look at Ebaumsworld too. I remember hearing about someone offering nearly $100M for his site, and he turned it down in a heartbeat. Not because he doesn't want the cash, or he thinks he'll make so much more than he already does, but because it's his baby.

So in short, WF means a hell of a lot to me than $16M does, and I consider myself lucky enough to not care about that amount of money anymore and look at things from my gut instinct point of view. Maybe it was a dumb decision on my part, we'll only tell for sure in the future.

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Jon

You're an idiot. I hate interviews actually. Ever notice why there really aren't any of them with me in it? Doh!

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Jon

Just read through all of the pages..

I think I explained my reasoning pretty well in the last two posts. Some of you may get it, others may not. I never pretend to be someone I'm not. I still answer all of my IM's and emails myself. I don't spend a lot of money at all on retarded things (sure, when I first made it big I got it out of my system by spending a lot of cash on dumb things, but it didn't last too long), I don't even like to drive so I'm not a Ferrari or any exotic car owner. I consider myself pretty down to earth, normal, and just a regular guy. I don't whore myself or my name out at all. I do everything on my own schedule, and I'm pretty happy with my life and business for the first time in years. I am proud of what I do and who I am, and most of all who I've become.

Believe me. Don't believe me. Either way, I could care less. I'm not going to sit around and argue with anyone either. I'll be in Vegas, if you want to ask me something there, go for it. I tend to only report on the really big things that effect me or my business. I like to keep things private for the most part, and if I were an attention whore, I'd be telling everyone in the world, when really, all I did was post it here.

I don't expect the usual fucktwats who don't believe anything anyone else says like Rob, or Engaged, or wickedDude.. But that's your call, and you can disagree all ya like. Especially Engaged, who used to IM me every fucking day with updates on his potential Google job. I never judged him or called him out on any of it, and if anything I remember offering a shitload of advice too. Thanks Brandon, I appreciate you always flipping me the bird you douche. WickedDude, another douche who always has something arrogant or foolish to say. You two need to get together and run a suicide hotline in Iraq, this way our soldiers won't have as many crazy fucks to deal with, because they would all off themselves to your shitty advice and opinions on situations. I won't ban you guys either, so no worries. Rob you fucktwat, saying I don't own the TM on WickedFire. How about you use some of the cash you've made over the last few months and pay a lawyer a few hundred bucks to look it up. I'm sure you'll be surprised with what they find. We also just submitted another trademark application for the WF logo, and some other WF related words.

What I love about naysayers in general is they allllllways have a fucking opinion about everything, but never the facts to back it up. And then, when predictions come true, well shit, you never hear them bringing up the fact that they disagreed or didn't believe me ever again. What a shocker eh? When I first announced everything about the WF resource area, everyone jumped on me like I was defrauding them and asking to fuck their sisters. Sure, people kept poking fun at it and still do. But when it comes down to it, and you actually SEE what we are spending so much time and effort on, I guarantee you guys will be some of the first that want access to it. Which is why I'm banning you 3 for life from it. While I'm in charge here, none of you will ever get access to it. Ever. It's not really a punishment for speaking your mind, so don't try and play that card. It's for ALWAYS speaking before you think. Especially Engaged, you have a lot to learn Mr I'm a huge hedgefund manager dipshit but I am trying to suck Google's cock to land a $60k a year job that I have to move to California to do too. You are definitely two sided. You sit there in IM's typing away with no response from me for hours just entertaining yourself, and act all nice, and then come here and start being a royal douchebag. What exactly do you bring to the table anyway?

Here's the best part of it all. If you guys don't value this place, and you can honestly say reading and learning shit on here for free for the last few months hasn't helped you or your business, then why are you still here? It reminds me of those empty threats that every liberal said before Bush was re-elected. They all swore up and down they would leave to Canada if he won. Well, guess what, he won, and none of them left, and the world didn't end, and all of their dopey predictions never came true. Thankfully most of their bitching and whining calmed down as they accepted defeat, but they'll always hate him or whatever he stands for, because it's all they know how to bitch about and complain. That's what I think most of these cocksuckers who never believe me, but hang onto every fucking thread here do. They are here for the free and easy ride, and either shit just isn't going right in their life, or they could just be bipolar. Who knows. The end result is that people who don't believe me (I've never lied once either..), or what I say, or what I post, will probably never believe me, and I accept that.

But what I'd like to know is what the fuck have you 3 guys done for the community in general aside for bitching and moaning nonstop? Did you make a forum that actually does some good? No. Do you have a blog where you actually give out advice that other people don't touch? No. Do you post your earnings and try and answer as many real questions about it? No. Do you not accept any money for consulting to people you've never met? No. Do you hold lightning rounds answering every question that comes your way as quickly and detailed as possible? No. Did you volunteer yourself to stand up in front of a live crowd at ASW and instead of doing some prewritten presentation ask instead to just do live Q&A from the audience, unscripted? No. Do you guys actually do anything aside for sitting around, bitching, and trying to tell people I'm lying when I've never done so on here or on SPF? No. I can go on and on too, so again... what do you guys offer this place? So please, before you go on and try to just blurt out useless shit on things you have ZERO knowledge of or facts on, explain to me, and everyone else, WHAT DO YOU ACTUALLY BRING TO THE FUCKING TABLE? Where are your earnings? Where are your volunteering time to answer questions every goddamn day? When did you ever invest lots of your own money into an idea or goal you were passionate about knowing full well that you wouldn't see any ROI for at least a year to help a community you are so fucking passionate about and involved in for so many years? That's what I'd like you assholes to answer.

Yeah, that pretty much covers it all for now.

/vent #2

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pig2cat

it's a good thing you didn't sell it...
the forum just isn't worth that much (yet)

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waraas

see ya in vegas

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Jon

Nope I agree. I even mentioned it on the phone "We have zero revenue. Technically, we are not even in the black or close to it from all of the cash I've been putting into it, and will continue to pour into it." And they still seemed to be interested in buying. I still have no real idea why someone would offer that much for this, but I'm also not asking them to understand my reasoning for rejecting the offer either, so maybe it was a good decision on my part, maybe not. But hey, I won't lose any sleep over it, and neither should any of you.

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feverinlove

point made: engaged is Jon's little bitch

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John

thanks for not selling, I love this place.

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emp

Dude...!

I can't even begin to tell you how amazed I am at this decision.
Of course, all I have is a nice paying job (and hopefully getting out of it) so I have not reached your income level... so, yes it is hard to understand.

But it is not that hard to understand when one has been with this forum for a while.

Thank you.

And that vent #2 was brilliant. LOLing all the way through.

Damn I love this place.

::emp::

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illusion

Same man, same. Jon thanks for clearing everything up making me laugh at those 3 guys

fenryr

It was the devil on the phone trying to buy your soul

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Matt

Loved Jons 'vent 2' haha!

Kyleirwins cocksucker thing was good too

marco

I've been browsing this forum for a number of days now, and as a CEO of a profitable internet holding company, and founder of several companies that have been sold, closed down or rolled into other companies, I've been looking at what is happening and where the market is going. Thank you.

First of all congratulations on the market niche that you are targeting.
Secondly. I have made 5,6,7 and 8 digit company sales in my life as an internet entrepreneur. Offcourse I was not the only partner in the companies above.

Like Jon, I've always had a superior target. I started with a 5 digit sale ($xx,xxx) and went up to 8 ($xx,xxx,xxx) after a number of years in the internet industry. Therefore I do see his point. But at the same time, I did make a number of mistakes, and did not sell a 'job site' I run to TMP Worldwide back then (used to be a parent of Monster). Which till this day I regret, because the offer was more then the value. The job site (after the dotcom burst), shut down.

But at the same time, being involved with a number of merchant bankers, learning the business, sitting on the board of a public company, I recall that sometimes we say: "we eat what is on the table". As another offer might not come back. It may, but it does not have to.

Also, my personal motto, is that I don't like working for the same company 2 or more years. Its boring. Its more to do with managing staff, rather then innovating. Therefore I personally always get out, when I get an offer...

Therefore, from my own experience. I would personally take the deal.

From what you said the deal is $16M. Is that cash, or is it some cash/debt. How would you 'value' that. Sometimes debt is good. For example. If the deal is $16M, make $5M cash, and rest $11M debt (at a revolving interest of 5-10%). You can do that. Therefore you have monthly or quarterly interest coming to you fro the $11M they ow you. There are a number fo things you can play around with. Make the debt convertible into shares.

Also you need to know (do your due diligence) of what the buyer is. Are they private. If so, if you take on debt, when will you cash out. Are they going public. What's their market cap. etc... etc... there is so many things to consider before closing a deal.

If I was the buyer and making that offer. I would first think WHY do I want to make this offer. And to me the number one reason is 'traffic', and what can I do with this 'traffic'. I also see from your 'header' that you will be moving into other services, then just the forum. Which Makes ALOT OF SENSE, and could bring in extra revenue for the buyer. Although I do think that achieving $2-4M/yr in revenues is very reasonable at your stage with all the services you tend to offer, the time to get there will be 1-2yrs. If you do have the patience, then I suggest you stick with it. But if you are like me and want to move onto the next 'hot' thing (web2.0), then I would cash out and start something new.

If you consider the $2-4M/yr in sales 2yrs from now, then the buyer is paying 4-6x multiples of 'potential' revenues. That's something you should not pass by.

This is my opinion. PM me if you do need advice. I don't charge for it



Marco.

illusion

Great advice marco, but he turned down the offer so your advice has expired

marco

Illusion. You can always re-negotiate the offer.

illusion

Shutup and stop putting ideas in Jons mind, this place is pimp

A-D

Wouldnt the best way and fastest, of reaching your $50m target be buy selling things that arent worth much for $16m?
Can you really see wickedfire or any other webmaster forum ever making the owner $16m revenue.
Last i heard digitalpoint forum from ad revenue made around $5k/month and thats the top marketing forum at the moment. Even if you succeed in your dream to make wickedfire the best in the industry its still not gonna bring you no where near as close to your 50m target as selling for 16m.
Did you just have this dream asleep and you enjoyed it so much thought you would turn it into reality huh.

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chrislingle

I am for the first time in a long time speachless


not for long!

lerchmo

Here is the issue. 16M is a rediculous sum of money for any kind of forum with 3000 registered members... from stuff I have done that probably means 500 regular posters. Andrew is right in that webmasters are a very valuable niche to some people but no one is stupid enough to open bidding on a forum this small with that number no matter how much money they have they will try and get a deal... $5000 per member is not a realistic number period.

well, hes obviously a fucktard because he doesn't realize how ridiculous his bid was and how asstasticly long it would take him to recoup his investment. He would be better served buying a taco bell franchise then cryogenicly freezing himself until it pulled 16m.
And who the fuck buys a forum for 16m without becoming a fucking member and seeing what its all about .
is a pretty fucking weak factor when it comes to dropping this kinda cash.

If someone offers you 2million for this forum they are pretty fucking serious.

How the fuck are you going to earn 2million a year from this forum within 5years is beyond me.

I have contributed some good shit to this forum but go ahead and flame me, I find this hard '100% impossible' to believe.

Mike

I hate these kinds of threads because they suck you in, and in the end you learned nothing. Don't get me wrong, I love hearing Jon rip up the 3 stooges and the back and forth debate about whether or not it was a real offer, blah, blah, blah.

I'm going back to work. MSN just fucked me on something so I need to fix that.

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE

A-D

The same way he is going to earn $150k/year from his blog. By thinking dreams are reality.

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Mike

Perception is reality.

If you perceive something to be true, the to you that is real.

Belief is the first step to accomplishing your goals.

Believe you can do it, and eventually you will find a way to make it happen.

Okay, really going back to work now...

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chrislingle

If I was 22 years old, had a degree from Michigan and made a good bit of coin from arbitrage - wanted to get into VC and had the chance to get an education at google for a couple years at $60k (plus my arbitrage money) I would say that was a good business decision. VC firms don't hire people without a few "real" jobs and the best learning experience is on the job training, and if you are from northern california what is the big deal in moving home? now if I was 33 and doing it that would be a different story

err, try again!

lerchmo

Mike your a nice guy.. but you have had 3 days of positive cash flow and now you sound like your ready to go on a motivational speaking tour!!!

you even had a "How I did it thread already" ?!?!

And perception is reality but someone elses dreams are definately NOT reality.

Sitemaker

Jon:

Stop living in a fucking illusion. Or actually, maybe I'll forgive you by saying you probably have some mental disorder that you cannot distinguish between your actual dreams and what's happening in real life.

I can't believe anyone would believe this for half a second. Just like making $150k/year on a blog with 30 readers.

Come on man. Stop with your shit already

(And who the FUCK WOULD buy a forum where every 3rd post is about 7search activation, ebooks, and porn?)

Mike

Damn lerchmo! You seem awful upset about this whole thing. Why?

I'm not going to jump on the Jon bandwagon and defend him, because I know as much about this as everyone else. But, I still don't see what he has to gain by announcing this. To me it just seemed like he wanted to share a weird experience.

As for my thread, that was how I made money on one campaign for those three days. I enjoy reading other people's success stories, so I thought I should share mine. Hopefully it will continue, but if it doesn't I'll find another way, and probably share that experience as well. We learn from other's mistakes and successes.

No, someone else's dreams are not YOUR reality. It may be theirs though. That's what I meant. What you perceive the point of Jon's post to be, is YOUR reality. If you believe he's just blowing smoke up your ass, then to YOU that is the reality of the situation. That's all I meant.

It just seems like people are getting too upset about a simple post by Jon.

All I give a shit about is: WickedFire is still here, it's not going anywhere and it has a hell of a community. So, whether someone offered Jon money for it or not doesn't concern me (as long as he doesn't sell).

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE

lerchmo

Obviously we are upset because we like this forum. And when the forum owner goes and says something that seems.. I wont even say how it seems. Some of us have invested time into making cool shit and sharing it with forum members mainly because we like the forum and the fact that it has less bullshit then other forums... had less bullshit.

And if somehow by some unbelievable stroke of improbability this fucktard really wants to pay 16m for this forum.....

Jon, you went about breaking the news extremely poorly. it just wreaks of
"HAHAH yeah fucking right". no one is that cavalier with 16million dollars and no one "doesn't think twice" about an offer so far over blown and ridiculous.

wtf, "so there is no issue about that?" this just sounds fucking fake. I was really hoping this was a joke and jon would be like HAHAH gotcha! later on.. but instead he defended himself by flaming the disbelievers.
Fucking read that 2x and see if you don't laugh. its outfuckingrageous.

I don't know what else to say I am just re-quoting the same shit.

At the end of this:
I like this forum.
this thread is bullshit.

Jdog

I obviously don't know if it's true or not, but I tend to believe what Jon says because I have never seen him bullshit about anything. I don't think wickedfire is worth that much, but it is worth more than the average forum because of the volume that the members do. There are idiots everywhere that pay too much or ask too much.

This is just the opposite of the prdeal thing.

Also look at the shit that is bought on DP and Sitepoint everyday for way too much, this is just a much larger scale.

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lerchmo

yeah, but not a much larger site.

illusion

lercho: there is nothing Jon can do to convince you, so you either believe him or not and stop posting shit like that. He didn't sell the forum, he got an offer for $16m, end of story and move on with your life.

No point in sitting here chatting bullshit over something that doesn't really matter one way or the other for us users