Back to the working world...

Geez, it's actually that bad for you guys out there? I was thinking of getting into SEO, AM, PPC, and all that jazz myself. I guess I won't be anymore.

Anyway, all the best in your new job! At the very least, it will give you a stable income, so you have the comfort & freedom to concentrate on side projects if time permits. Having clients, and allowing them to take advantage of you, because they know you need the money, sucks. Been there, done that.
 


Nothing wrong with having a 9-5 as a web developer in the USA. Still beats about 95% of the world's living standards. Thanks for the honesty, and may the indian gods rain luck on you sir.
 
I've been reading this forum for a while, and I thought most people made decent money online here, but I guess I was wrong lol.
If you are going back to a 9-5 job then something is very wrong....

You should stop reading this forum and start taking some action.
 
I think there are 2 options when you're struggling to make ends meet with your IM efforts:

1- Get a job
2- Move to a country where you can live off less than $1000 a month (South America and Asia are full of them)

I think most of us would go for #2 (unless you have commitments such as kids, sick parents, big debts, etc...)

exactly.
 
Nice little honest thread in WF for a change.

I was looking for a dev job from about last Summer as well but couldn't get one. I was doing programming work on oDesk for a while which was shite. Was doing Magento and iPhone/Android apps on the side and it slowly took off. Now I've got a nice little client business going, every idiot seems to want a mobile app these days and e-commerce dev always pays well.

Some people hate client work but I like it, get to travel around the country a bit for meetings and get out of the office here.

agreed, love your spirit brother.
 
Nice little honest thread in WF for a change.

I was looking for a dev job from about last Summer as well but couldn't get one. I was doing programming work on oDesk for a while which was shite. Was doing Magento and iPhone/Android apps on the side and it slowly took off. Now I've got a nice little client business going, every idiot seems to want a mobile app these days and e-commerce dev always pays well.

Some people hate client work but I like it, get to travel around the country a bit for meetings and get out of the office here.

You doing any iPhone app for yourself?
One of my best friends just quit his Day job (High six figures) from one of the Largest Tech companies in the world from just one App. He is now partnered with me in a new venture.

There are some categories where every half assed App is lapped up.. So those idiots maybe turning a profit on every app you are making for a few thousand bucks.

PPS: We are always looking for good designers to design icons and stuff.. We tried a couple from here and didn't like it..
 
I might be the minority here but 9-5s are the it that bad. You grow, learn, get motivated and get paid.

Im talking about working for a successful corp, not some shit mom and pop a public co.

Ppl that hate on 9-5s either work at mcdonalds or got some dough from a b model that's not sustainable.

Rob kyosaki worked at xerox for 4 years u gunna hate?
 
I knew 99% of the people on this forum gave up and went back to the real world when I posted a $4.99/year hosting offer and got one sign-up. Posted it on WHT and got 40+. There was a time when I could fill up a server in 48 hours by posting here.
 
I think one lesson to be learned here is that brokering traffic (whether it's SEO or PPC or whatever) isn't actually an asset, especially not something self sustaining. You need more than the traffic, you need something with value.

I call bullshit. Next you're going to say that you should build a sales funnel to monetize all of your traffic at various/gradually increasing levels of commitment while building a brand selling your own products or something like the most important skill to have is the ability to sell & build relationships.

Eventually you're going to say something ridiculous like diversifying into businesses with a high barrier of entry is a good thing.

Slither off with that bullshit bros...

To the OP. All that matters is that you're happy.

Good luck in life and I hope you're happy.

EDIT: I wonder how many guys who are broke now have criticized the gurus who have actual staying power?
 
You should stop reading this forum and start taking some action.

THIS times 100000000000000000000...relationships can be made in STS but not dollars. Figure out your ROI on surfing STS all day sometime, not even burger flipping monies.

I knew 99% of the people on this forum gave up and went back to the real world when I posted a $4.99/year hosting offer and got one sign-up. Posted it on WHT and got 40+. There was a time when I could fill up a server in 48 hours by posting here.

Maybe if your default server permissions weren't a fucking nightmare...can't upload a photo to WP without changing folder permissions through direct admin first? I'll pass...shame, because uptime was always good and Chris is support ninja.
 
Maybe if your default server permissions weren't a fucking nightmare...can't upload a photo to WP without changing folder permissions through direct admin first? I'll pass...shame, because uptime was always good and Chris is support ninja.

DirectAdmin runs a normal Apache setup and executes PHP as the Apache user. Files and folders you upload are owned by your user account. If you want Apache to do things it doesn't have permission to do, you have to change your file permissions. That's just the way DA works. You could always just chmod 777 everything for WP on our setup and it wouldn't hurt a thing (it's not going to be a security issue).
 
You doing any iPhone app for yourself?
One of my best friends just quit his Day job (High six figures) from one of the Largest Tech companies in the world from just one App. He is now partnered with me in a new venture.

I've a few ideas but backed up with client apps. We all know some apps make a killing but how many don't? Take 1 or 2 months development and go nowhere. I'd be charging from 5k-15k, You'd need a good few sales to make that back.

I'm also shit at graphics and always looking for creative people, you need really good and eye-catching graphics to make an app sell.

I knew 99% of the people on this forum gave up and went back to the real world when I posted a $4.99/year hosting offer and got one sign-up. Posted it on WHT and got 40+. There was a time when I could fill up a server in 48 hours by posting here.

Maybe everyone already had a dedicated server or 2 for their sites?
 
Maybe everyone already had a dedicated server or 2 for their sites?

Nope. I've slowly been watching some of my biggest clients (in terms of domains and how long they've had accounts) cancel everything. I look at their domains after they cancel and they've all expired. Sure, there are definitely people who have moved up to dedicated servers (I often help them move), but the majority of people realized that you can't just toss up some WP blog and make a living from ebay/amazon/etc links.

Two years ago 90% of the sites I hosted were affiliate related. Now I'd say that's down to 10% affiliate and 90% sites with "real" content.
 
My advice to those people who believe that their affiliate marketing / internet marketing / seo / whatever careers will last for your entire life is this: don't count on it.

For example, let's say you're 25 years old. Fast forward 10 years, you're now 35. Will it still be possible to make money by yourself with nothing more than an internet connection, a $10 hosting account, a strong work ethic, and a healthy supply of indians ready to work for $5/hr? What will you do at that point? I don't care if you're the smartest motherfucker in the room and ready to adapt...there's no telling what the future holds. You need to consider that you *might* have to get a job. No companies are going to give a shit that you used to make a boat load of cash without even having to put pants on or leave your house. They'll say cool story bro, and move on to somebody else.

8 years ago I setup my first adwords campaign. It took 15 minutes or so. For the next 6 months, I didn't touch the campaign and I did over $100k in revenue, 60k or so was profit. That is simply not possible today. It doesn't matter if you adapted along the way...the environment has changed considerably and will continue to do so.

I did what I had to do, and sooner or later you might find yourself facing similar situations. I'm just glad that my "easy monies" dried up in my mid 20's, and not in my mid 30's.

I've also done work by myself for clients. I much prefer my new environment, being surrounded by likeminded entrepreneurial people like myself. Even if it's technically a 9 - 5. A rev share also makes things a little sweeter.
 
No companies are going to give a shit that you used to make a boat load of cash without even having to put pants on or leave your house. They'll say cool story bro, and move on to somebody else.

Ain't that the truth, blank work history looks like shit if you're looking for a real job. I've been doing this since college so had nothing to show and got nowhere when I was looking for a job last year.

"Are you sure you can adapt to a 'real job' now?"

"Will you be able to get up on Monday mornings when you're not used to it?"

Piss off, I probably work harder than most of your staff.
 
I had a strong suspicion that this forum is populated by a lot of people making $0 and a few "ballers" making $5k-10k.

Man what a waste of time...

Arbitrage isn't a business.
 
My advice to those people who believe that their affiliate marketing / internet marketing / seo / whatever careers will last for your entire life is this: don't count on it.

For example, let's say you're 25 years old. Fast forward 10 years, you're now 35. Will it still be possible to make money by yourself with nothing more than an internet connection, a $10 hosting account, a strong work ethic, and a healthy supply of indians ready to work for $5/hr? What will you do at that point? I don't care if you're the smartest motherfucker in the room and ready to adapt...there's no telling what the future holds. You need to consider that you *might* have to get a job. No companies are going to give a shit that you used to make a boat load of cash without even having to put pants on or leave your house. They'll say cool story bro, and move on to somebody else.

8 years ago I setup my first adwords campaign. It took 15 minutes or so. For the next 6 months, I didn't touch the campaign and I did over $100k in revenue, 60k or so was profit. That is simply not possible today. It doesn't matter if you adapted along the way...the environment has changed considerably and will continue to do so.

I did what I had to do, and sooner or later you might find yourself facing similar situations. I'm just glad that my "easy monies" dried up in my mid 20's, and not in my mid 30's.

I've also done work by myself for clients. I much prefer my new environment, being surrounded by likeminded entrepreneurial people like myself. Even if it's technically a 9 - 5. A rev share also makes things a little sweeter.

OP, you're entirely correct. It sounds like you were spoiled by affiliate marketing.

I honestly look to affiliate marketers for cutting edge insight into squeezing every penny out of my Internet Marketing campaigns, but I've never been a full-time affiliate marketer (So I honestly don't know what easy money from the Internet feels like just for putting up an adwords campaign.)... Even though, when I was DEAD BROKE... Picking up spare change around my apartment for food for the week I never considered getting a job. Just didn't cross my mind.

I'm not attacking your work ethic or character, but it sounds like you were more of a guy who came across how to make quick money than you are an entrepreneur or that you didn't have the drive to turn your early successes into a business empire of sorts... (Which in all honestly is mind-boggling that you'd watch people making millions pushing offers through affiliates and never made your own. Shit, even I'm launching a few health products through aff networks right now and I've never been a health affiliate.)

If I can offer any advice it would be to ALWAYS BE HUNGRY and NEVER BE SATISFIED.

I also don't see why you couldn't just throw together a media kit, build a bunch of websites so you had a portfolio of "clients", and start cold-walking businesses offering a free marketing audit, then up-selling yourself for a few hundred dollars on the spot. Gosh, I don't know why you couldn't of programmed yourself together a niche local business directory and offered free spots with optional sponsored listings, then went ahead and hooked up with local marketing businesses selling access to your business leads, "Who are interested in online marketing" for a nominal fee.

Heck, I don't know why you couldn't of simply taken 20K of that 60K you made your first year and started developing products based on what your most successful affiliate campaigns were sending traffic to.

Geeze, I don't know why you couldn't of taken a UBot Studio license and bombarded the shit out of Craigslist's services section selling moving and labor while farming out the work, eventually getting licensing and working your own leads...

Not that I know anything about making money. We all know that WickedFire doesn't have anyone that actually makes money. I mean... it's not like I have gmario lambos or anything... but I'm doing alright for a young guy.
 
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Arbitrage isn't a business.

Another easy statement to make but not true. What exactly do you think media brokers do? They're just as much the unnessecary step between the client and the media. They sell media space, no different than if you sell media space in Google's organic search results or media space on Facebook.

One way or another you own a virtual magazine/property which gets eyes and you sell that ad space. It's in no way a new business model.

The problem as I see it is that a lot of people have done the equivalent of passing out flyers (some actually did irl with the berries) instead of bulding a media broker agency.