On the Brink of War?
- Thread starter Jon
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Alright so let me offer my opinion on several different levels. For starters, there's no way Israel would have retaliated as it did without okay'ing it with United States first. This was not the first time Israeli soldiers have been kidnapped by Hezbollah, it's happened several times before within the last decade. United States backs Israel in several days ways. Both financially and in military. Where do you think those Israeli Patriot missiles came from? The one's installed next to Haifa?
Now, to clarify something. For the paranoid screaming that it's a United States-sponsored assault on Lebanon. That's false. United States has been sponsoring Israel for decades, regardless of what Israel has been doing at the time.
There's also several reasons why the United States doesn't seriously object to the Israeli occupation of south Lebanon. For one, Hezbollah bombed the United States embassy twice in Beirut in 1983 and 1984. To top it off, Syria and Iran are the main sponsors of Hezbollah. And it's no secret how badly United States wants to get its fingers around Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's throat.
Has anyone seen what happened to oil when the news first came out? It went from 72 and set a record at $78. When a crisis like this happens, there's only a handful of companies that make money. Defense companies, and finance companies are trading oil contracts. There's a good reason why Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley all had record profits last year.
Lastly, I have an old friend who's currently in North Carolina but is going back to Iraq for the second time. Based on what he said, there's no way we have enough soldiers on the ground to go into Iran. And if we do, there's going to be a lot of blood from both sides. We'll be getting shot at from every direction. Syrian troops will go into iraq from the north, Iran will come from the West. Not to mention the insurgents that are within iraq already.
Now, to clarify something. For the paranoid screaming that it's a United States-sponsored assault on Lebanon. That's false. United States has been sponsoring Israel for decades, regardless of what Israel has been doing at the time.
There's also several reasons why the United States doesn't seriously object to the Israeli occupation of south Lebanon. For one, Hezbollah bombed the United States embassy twice in Beirut in 1983 and 1984. To top it off, Syria and Iran are the main sponsors of Hezbollah. And it's no secret how badly United States wants to get its fingers around Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's throat.
Has anyone seen what happened to oil when the news first came out? It went from 72 and set a record at $78. When a crisis like this happens, there's only a handful of companies that make money. Defense companies, and finance companies are trading oil contracts. There's a good reason why Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley all had record profits last year.
Lastly, I have an old friend who's currently in North Carolina but is going back to Iraq for the second time. Based on what he said, there's no way we have enough soldiers on the ground to go into Iran. And if we do, there's going to be a lot of blood from both sides. We'll be getting shot at from every direction. Syrian troops will go into iraq from the north, Iran will come from the West. Not to mention the insurgents that are within iraq already.
I don't think we'll leave Iraq or Afghanistan any time soon, if ever. Just look at a map and see what's on either side of Iran.
right
Think about it, if they have control over a lot of the oil and try to hold that over our heads, FUCK em. Yeah we would pay some outrageous gas prices, but I say go in their and Blow up everyone of their damn refinerys. Doing this would cut off their money they would be able to give to terrorist groups. Hell just blow up half of them, do a damn Google Dance on their refinerys then they will have to buckle down.
Yes this is totally not going to happen, but hell if you want to kick a countries ass just take out their sources of revenue.Kind of what the terrorists tried to do with the 9/11 attacks in NY.
I also think the way israel is smoking up the landscape in lebanon, taking out their bridges, runways, ports etc etc. Lock hezbolah in. :ak:
I do feel sorry for the lebanese civilians but the govt should be held accountable for allowing terrorists to maintain control and failing to live up to their end of the bargain as they agreed to do in the UN Resolution which was passed but not followed through on.:action-smiley-052:
Yes I agree with your friend, we don't have enough troops on the ground in that theatre to go into iraq. But thats not the point, really. We dont just send the troops in like we used to. We send in some missles and pepper our targets then send in the Fighter Jets and Bombers and pepper some more. Then once we take out our strategic points we turn around and start sending a bat of grunts in to check out the AO.stanley said:
Think about it, if they have control over a lot of the oil and try to hold that over our heads, FUCK em. Yeah we would pay some outrageous gas prices, but I say go in their and Blow up everyone of their damn refinerys. Doing this would cut off their money they would be able to give to terrorist groups. Hell just blow up half of them, do a damn Google Dance on their refinerys then they will have to buckle down.
Yes this is totally not going to happen, but hell if you want to kick a countries ass just take out their sources of revenue.Kind of what the terrorists tried to do with the 9/11 attacks in NY.
I also think the way israel is smoking up the landscape in lebanon, taking out their bridges, runways, ports etc etc. Lock hezbolah in. :ak:
I do feel sorry for the lebanese civilians but the govt should be held accountable for allowing terrorists to maintain control and failing to live up to their end of the bargain as they agreed to do in the UN Resolution which was passed but not followed through on.:action-smiley-052:
israeli girls writing messages on artillery shells:
http://urshalim.blogspot.com/2006/07/sad-ugly-how-can-we-expect-peace-in.html#links
[WARNING: fourth photo is very grisly]
I have to say I disagree with most of you. I've been following this very closely and it seems mainstream american media is very biased so I don't blame you.
Israel is not just trying to hurt Hezbollah. It is trying to destroy the will of the Lebanese people. Bombing bridges (merely an inconvenience for hezbollah), destroying the airport (took billions and many years to build), power plants, etc. These are civilian targets.
Removing Hezbollah is a lot more complex than it sounds. Lebanon is a very diverse country. The shiites have been the traditionally oppressed group and look to Hezbollah as their guardian. Many experts say that a disarmament would lead to another civil war.
http://urshalim.blogspot.com/2006/07/sad-ugly-how-can-we-expect-peace-in.html#links
[WARNING: fourth photo is very grisly]
I have to say I disagree with most of you. I've been following this very closely and it seems mainstream american media is very biased so I don't blame you.
Israel is not just trying to hurt Hezbollah. It is trying to destroy the will of the Lebanese people. Bombing bridges (merely an inconvenience for hezbollah), destroying the airport (took billions and many years to build), power plants, etc. These are civilian targets.
Removing Hezbollah is a lot more complex than it sounds. Lebanon is a very diverse country. The shiites have been the traditionally oppressed group and look to Hezbollah as their guardian. Many experts say that a disarmament would lead to another civil war.
Ok for one we are not per say biased, hezbollah needs to be disarmed and should have been done years ago. Why deosnt hezbollah give the israelian soldiers back. Hezbollah is merely nothing but a puppet to Iran.vizilla said:
As far as tthe people writing messages on the bombs , hell thats nothing new. Every Army in the world does the same thing, consider it a moral booster for the soldiers risking their lives to do their duty for their countries.
What would Israel get by destroying the will of the people of lebanon?
As far as the bombing of the bridges, power plants, Airports hell thats a must in any strategic military plan. Knock out their power you destroy their communications, Knockout the bridges and airports it knocks out their modes of transporting supplies to keep the war extended longer than necessary.
Any country that supports terrorism should take full responsibility for doing so! Don't support terrorists then when the hammer gets brought down upon you start claiming innocence.
Israel has been giving up land, and removing their occupational forces along gaza just to bring peace to the region, hell I think they should fight til their hearts content, Their probably tired of taking shit from everyone around them.
layboy_sml:I thought it was ironic that there was outrage about Israeli children writing on the bombs, considering the Hezbollah and Hamas terrorist send children to blow themselves up. Where's the outrage over that?
why doesn't israel release the thousands of palestinians in its jail that are held indefinitely for years without trial?Mill said:
im not sure if youve been keeping up with the reading...most experts agree that this attacking of civilian targets is completely unnecessary...hezbollah is also in the SOUTH of the country...they're bombing beirut and the christian areas too...Mill said:
this will be my last post on the subject, as it is quite obvious this is going to turn into a flame war and i am clearly outnumbered
Because they have a track record of blowing things up, and instead of killing them, they provide a lot of valuable intel on their "brothers" and their plans to kill more innocent people in Israel with their suicide attacks.vizilla said:
Israel has Mossad, which happens to make the CIA and NSA look like kindergarten kids in the intelligence community. With that said, do you really think they don't know the targets that they are hitting? See, this is what really bugs me about the way these terror groups fight their wars. They are known for hiding bombs in civilian/residential areas, instead of in proper storage facilities. Why do they do this? Because they know, that when Israel bombs the shit out of the house, and accidentally kills the people living in there, whether they are women or children, Hezbollah can now claim that Israel is killing innocent civilians.vizilla said:
It's the same thing where this movie called "Rules Of Engagement" showed how the Arabs were fighting. They would stick women (dressed like snipers) holding children side by side with Arab snipers. Why would they put these women and children into a situation like this? Because again, they are dirty fighters. They knew that if the Marines would shoot back and hit what looked like a sniper, but was really a woman or child, they could play the victim and blame the US Marines for shooting "innocent victims".
It's total bullshit. I really don't get why people stick up for Hezbollah or Hamas and call them innocent, or even the people who support them innocent. They are not innocent. They live for one thing. The destruction of Israel and America.
Again, I hope Israel levels Lebanon, Syria and Iran. Turn them all into parking lots.. and if they have anything left over, I'd like to see France turned into a giant Wal-Mart, because no one really needs those complainers either.
Not to point out the obvious, but It's pretty understandable to be pissed off when for the better part of the 20th century other countries like Britain, etc have been splitting up Palestine in various ways to create a Jewish state eventually leading to the birth of the current Israel. No one is going to admire terrorists or people who just can't fucking share but they're hardly unwarranted.Jon said:
What a joke. This country was built on dissent. There's nothing wrong with disagreeing with the goverment. A government that has repeatedly ignored the principles this country was founded on.Mill said:
I'm so disgusted by the rampant disrespect for France.Jon said:
France opposed entering Iraq and guess what? Most if not all of their reasons and concerns turned out to be justified. Just because people disagree with you doesn't mean that you have a right to say that they are worthless.wikipedia said:
JDA said:
That concept he talked about isn't too complex, it's just basic military strategy and the allusion to the movie wasn't to discuss the political situation. That's how I read it.
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Still this is an overreaction on the part of Israel, and it's too bad for Lebanon. Lebanon couldn't keep Hezbollah out because they were restricted on their military development, now they are watching their country being crushed after they had spent many years after civil war building it up to a pretty nice place.
Lebanon had an American friendly government, and a government that was elected by democratic means. With this conflict, Isreal has created many more terrorist symphasizers, and possibly American haters.
Israel should have sent its special forces (which are said to be top notch) in, killed the bastard hezbollah, and left the airports and civilian systems alone.
joe said:
I'm sure you can tell I'm liberal by now, but I agree with this.
And on the movie thing, it's obvious that Jon thinks Arab terrorists are the only ones who fight that way (because of the movie or not, I don't know), and he should probably do some more digging. Everyone does atrocious shit during war, and nobody's hands stay clean. That's war. That's why you don't go to war unless you really fucking need to, and that's where we've fucked up in my opinion.
JDA said:
Actually, the movie showed EXACTLY how Arabs fight. Hence the reference. Normally I wouldn't care about a Hollywood flick, but considering that they were right on the money it seemed like a good example.
You liberals are always too quick to badmouth or bash us. And the greatest part is that you never have any real facts or reasons to back up what you say. You always want to change the world and save the whales, and have lots of group hugs, and you think every Republican is doing a horrible job, and that you guys can do better.
If anyone is pathetic, it's the liberals. They have an opinion and argument about EVERYTHING and never a realistic solution. They just like to bitch and moan and have their stupid and pointless rallies about this and that, but they never actually do a goddamn thing about it.
znine said:
Funny.. Didn't we find out that France had a partnership with Iraq about doing some really shady deals for oil? Ohh yeah, no wonder they didn't want to attack their business partner..
And then the kicker was that after the US went into Iraq, France publically announced... along with Germany and Russia (who were all opposed to the war at first) that they would be sending troops there as well. Hypocritical don't ya think?
And last thing.. Wasn't it France who sold Sadam Hussein that weapons grade nuclear reactor thing that Israel eventually destroyed with precision bombing in the 80's?
Yep, France sure are winners in my book.. Book of complete failures in all wars except for the ones they fight against themselves. Fuck France.
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