Product Sellers Forum?

metoo said:
Hehe... When I first started this thread, I was actually going to write about how comes there's so much hate for info products around here!?!

Personally I've been an affiliate and a product owner. I know why the 'I maik moniez' products get slack. But all info products aren't about that - there is a completely different (lucrative) world above that.

Different set of pros and cons of being either. But I personally see the move towards being a product owner as a profit progression of being an affiliate, but of course, it comes with a whole load of extra hassle.

Different strokes I guess. One thing I know for sure is that being a product owner taught me a boat load more about being a better affiliate.
Click to expand...

Thank You God - finally someone who gets it. First of all, I wish someone would post a link to this in the noob section.

If there is one thing I regret down to my soul when I firsted MMO is just that - I LEARNED TO MMO, NOT BUILD REAL WEALTH.

As someone said, there's a reason why companies pay affiliates. I kick myself when I realize how long it took me to realize one shouldn't be investing in affiliate marketing; one should be investing IN AFFILIATE MARKETERS.

A valuable list that you can build a profitable, "relationship marketing" exchange with, that look to you as their one and only source of answers to a particular problem, is the closest thing to push button profits on this planet.

The problem with WF is that there's a group of new rich people who are making money in affiliate marketing and have convinced themselves "we don't need to read we test...info products are stupid".

It starts with not understanding the value of information. As an example, there are 1 Billion pages on the internet. Let's say I am looking for some info to execute on ABC. I could spend 10 hours swimming through forum threads, scanning websites. or I could spend 1 hour and $97 dollars getting the info from the right info product. The other 9 hours I can use getting outsourcers to implement what I read.

The person who believes "I don't buy that info product crap, why pay for information!" Sillily believes they are "smart" because they didn't pay any money. Well time is money! It's called "The Information Age" for a reason.

These days there's a world of "know" and "know nots" and it determines the "haves" and "have nots".

The way I look at is that info products give you the "what" and software enables you to implement the info - the "how" faster.


All those people going on and on about info products need to talk to the guy who doesn't have to worry about PPC. He/she has a mega responsive list that he can sell $97, $597 and $997 products to for the full life of the customer.

IMHO, the quickest way to passive, sustainable wealth is this:

-1) Find a "stay awake at night problem"
ex.
"how to grow your business"
"how to find a partner/keep a good marriage"
"movies, music" - ex. more than 50% of iphone users make over $100,000/year and spend on average $100/month at the itunes store - THEY HAVE THEIR CC INFO ON FILE AND MAKE IMPULSIVE BUYS ALL THE TIME!!!

-2) Build a list of people with this problem/challenge; MAKE SURE IT'S AN ONGOING PROBLEM SO THEY WILL ALWAYS BE LOOKING FOR YOU TO HELP WITH YOUR SOLUTIONS


-3) DESIGN A RECURRING, RESIDUAL REVENUE MODEL (think product updates, membership sites, roundtable in person summits each year, etc)
where you develop info products, software or referral services (ex. affiliate marketing) around that one particular issues.

Put it this way, let's say someone makes $50k a year (avg. american) and spends $1000/year on that problem. MAKE IT SO THEY ALWAYS SPEND THAT $1000/year WITH YOU.

It will only that a relatively small, but responsible list to generate 7 or 8 figures a year for life.

*You don't have to worry about google - you are on their list

*You don't have to worry about someone seeing your ads and copying them - they are on your list not out in public

*You have an asset (a list) WITH A REAL MARKET VALUE. Let's be real, when you do AM, does your converting KW list have a market value?

*If networks are paying $1-$5 just for an email and name, if you have that for your list, it has a market value

*You have currency with which to negotiate with other companies, JV partners, etc

*You have something to pass on to your kids. If you have a website and google with all it's unpredictable updates is your only source of traffic, as someone who invests in websites, let me tell you I am not going to value that website too much.


This i sjust my humble opinion here. If I had it to do again, I would make sure every single link I dropped went to an optin page. Yes it takes the monies longer to pile up but I think it is far more stable - you aren't just "making money online" you are "building a business" and "building wealth".

/RG

PS
I came across this list. Alot of typical make IM stuff you have to swim through but it could be an interesting source of JV Partners:

ListSwapper.com | Find Ad Swap Partners
Matt Garrett's Internet Marketing AdSwaps
Adswap Finder|
My list is 9,300+ – wanna ad swap?|Adswap Finder
ListSwapper.com | Find Ad Swap Partners
JV Notify Pro Joint Venture Community - Index
JVME.com | Joint Venture Social Network by Chuck Mullaney
The IM Joint Venture Social Network
The JV University - Become a 'Million Dollar' Joint Venture Broker

PPS
ANYONE CARE TO COMMENT ON THEIR EXPERIENCE WITH JVNOTIFYPRO ? I hear he want to expand outside of the typical IM stuff.

I met one guy there with a PHD who had some kind of product related to chemistry or something!



The other days I was looking at some stats on a group of sites and to
is the closest thing to push button money and push button pla
 
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I am down for a forum like that. Started selling my own product this year and it's been so much fun getting 100% of the profit.
 
We can give this a run, but only under the condition that the forum is open to everyone, at least in the beginning. Once the section reaches critical mass, we will make the forum exclusive to members who have contributed the most. Those members will be able to invite others.
 
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+rep riddarhusetgal

It's not just info products, this applies to all things affiliates gobble up.

AM is something you should do first as it's a easier way to learn IM and you need less capital. But many people get stuck here.

Look at Force Factor. It's a legit product and the reason it's beating all the "get ripped with acai" scams is because all of their marketing is done in-house. It doesn't go to a flog or other BS, it's straight to their site. They can advertise on the big traffic sources that is restricted to affiliates. It also cuts out the $40+ they have to pay to the network and affiliate. They are more profitable than their competitors and can sleep at night knowing they're selling something legit.

As for info products, theres this clickbank product on farmville YES FUCKING FARMVILLE that is doing incredible sales. In fact they are selling everyday in the thousands at $27 each. But if you still thing selling info is crap then yes you are right, this isn't worth it. The advantage here is that if you have a market with a very specific problem, you can make something that is tailor made to suit their needs.

Problem is that you need to spend time and money to build a real business. The things that nearly all affiliates are just not willing to do. Oh well, less competition for me. :D
 
While an ebook on farmville might be selling good now, the problem with ebooks like this (and most ebooks in general) is that it's not an evergreen product. Yeah you can make good money but you have to hustle constantly and come out with new products on a regular basis in order to keep the money coming in.

Of course you can outsource this kind of thing a lot of times (find a long-time farmville player, pay them $500 to "interview" them, and pay someone else another $500 or so to turn it into an ebook). But that's still not a real business. The product has a short life cycle and most likely all your ebooks are going to be on different topics so you are starting from scratch with each project. And that's the most tedious part - actually developing the product/offer.

There's nothing wrong with going for a quick buck, but even better would be to develop some kind of long-term sustainable business rather than just hustling from one "project" to the next. It's no biggie when you're young and snorting adderall every day, but as you get older the constant hustle gets old too ...
 
Stanley said:
We can give this a run, but only under the condition that the forum is open to everyone, at least in the beginning. Once the section reaches critical mass, we will make the forum exclusive to members who have contributed the most. Those members will be able to invite others.
Click to expand...
Can we still call out the scam artists and bullshitters, and post links to free downloads of their info products? Will ebook sales still be banned?

Also, page 2 of this thread is hilarious.
 
Stanley said:
We can give this a run, but only under the condition that the forum is open to everyone, at least in the beginning. Once the section reaches critical mass, we will make the forum exclusive to members who have contributed the most. Those members will be able to invite others.
Click to expand...

Hi Stanley. I respect your decision, but with all due respect I love a good ole market/capitalism solution for any problem!

I feel that charging an appropriately high price - let's say $49-$199/month does two things:

1) It prequalifies membership - only those with business results (i.e. money)/the ability to pay - or those who VALUE GOOD INFORMATION will be attracted to the forum

I'm sure I'm not the only one that realizes aftrer a while it's alot harder to find more time than money. One of the issues with "open" forums is the bullshit and nonsense you have to swim through....useless comments, going off on tangents, etc.

Lastly, from my own experience, people would be more willing to share tangibly valuable information - like phone numbers to direct contacts, software, business systems, mindmaps, etc, under these circumstances...

Maybe a free section, just to test it out, but from my own experience these days the paid forums (some costing me 3 figures a month) produce positive ROI.

One example is a good mailing list swap. Sometimes you might have to pay JV brokers thousands to organize something for you. But on a good forum, you can get that same deal for the price of the monthly membership.

Anyone not willing to pay for valuable information is not someone I probably would end up doing business with anyway - IT'S CALLED THE INFORMATION ECONOMY RIGHT?

I don't know where this whole idea of "paying for information" being stupid that persists on WF comes from....

On a different note, one of the ideas some colleagues and I are toying with are online summits for b2b clients or institutional investors - basically they get to save a plane ticket or better yet, instead of 5 analysts going to a conference, they can listen in on a conference call and still get the info....

This could extended to the b2b digital marketing crowd or Inc5000 crowd for anyone who so desires...
this is a very lucrative market and just yesterday I was on a call with 6 people, 3 continents and was amazed by how well it went....I'm referring to something along the lines of the conferences these guys produce:

Information Management Network (IMN) Global Organizers of Institutional Finance & Investment Conferences
 
I ask myself - why don't you guys organize one or two meetings irl (yes! in real life) to establish interests, direction of the board and the owner's declaration of intent. Despite what I wrote to Philip I do understand his motives. However..... those people setting up these communities do not mingle on strictly faceless net websites. Besides, I have really bad experiences with community-ish proposals where staff has never met eachother prior in real life.

(another good thing about RL setup meetings = it cleans out all scammers, lurkers and other bad crowd instantly :) )
 
riddarhusetgal said:
Lastly, from my own experience, people would be more willing to share tangibly valuable information - like phone numbers to direct contacts, software, business systems, mindmaps, etc, under these circumstances...
http://secure.imn.org/web_main/index.cfm
Click to expand...

See, there's another side to that one though. If I was paying $200 for membership, I better be learning more than I'm contributing. That's the other side that some people will see. Otherwise, why contribute if I'm paying for it?

Keep in mind what happened with the premium sec here after all ...
 
Just setup the g'damn forum already, whether it be here or a separate site (if it's not up already). Enough talk ;)
 
yao1994 said:
+rep riddarhusetgal

It's not just info products, this applies to all things affiliates gobble up.

AM is something you should do first as it's a easier way to learn IM and you need less capital. But many people get stuck here.

Look at Force Factor. It's a legit product and the reason it's beating all the "get ripped with acai" scams is because all of their marketing is done in-house. It doesn't go to a flog or other BS, it's straight to their site. They can advertise on the big traffic sources that is restricted to affiliates. It also cuts out the $40+ they have to pay to the network and affiliate. They are more profitable than their competitors and can sleep at night knowing they're selling something legit.

As for info products, theres this clickbank product on farmville YES FUCKING FARMVILLE that is doing incredible sales. In fact they are selling everyday in the thousands at $27 each. But if you still thing selling info is crap then yes you are right, this isn't worth it. The advantage here is that if you have a market with a very specific problem, you can make something that is tailor made to suit their needs.

Problem is that you need to spend time and money to build a real business. The things that nearly all affiliates are just not willing to do. Oh well, less competition for me. :D
Click to expand...

You know the funny thing about Clickbank? It has a great reputation outside of AM circles. You don't get to be the world's largest seller of digital products by chance. The guy who charges me $500/hour for IM consultation loves them and he has been using them for years. I am about to go with clickbank and nanacast (I also get a free membership of a nanacast spin off called mixiv). This guy has been online since the 90's and has OVER 3,000 affiliates.

You know I love those quiet guys who may not have "big balls" i.e. forum rep but they are rolling in real net worth (read assets not just making money)....I mean this guy wears his humble clothes and his Texan's gear and he is a well spring of knowledge - I digress here though....


I was just privy to a story that showed how Partner Traffic + Affiliate traffic is the highest roi traffic out there - no longer do you have to worry about google, the linking merry go round, social bookmarks, the list goes on.

I did an experiment about 3 weeks ago. I sent dropbox.com some traffic. Then I emailed their head of business development and said "I just sent you guys xyz users, our open rates are abc, our partners are blah blah blah"- the response was instant....

The whole point is that when you have:
-your own list
-your own product
-your own affiliates

There's no caps on what you can do vs. the affiliate model.....just my thoughts....in 2010 we are spending more resources on training affiliates and JV partners than any source of traffic....it may take longer but we can say "kiss my ass" to you know who!
 
to everyone bitching about it being set up, i set it up days ago. posted multiple times. pm me for the url
 
riddarhusetgal said:
Hi Stanley. I respect your decision, but with all due respect I love a good ole market/capitalism solution for any problem!

I feel that charging an appropriately high price - let's say $49-$199/month does two things:

1) It prequalifies membership - only those with business results (i.e. money)/the ability to pay - or those who VALUE GOOD INFORMATION will be attracted to the forum

I'm sure I'm not the only one that realizes aftrer a while it's alot harder to find more time than money. One of the issues with "open" forums is the bullshit and nonsense you have to swim through....useless comments, going off on tangents, etc.

Lastly, from my own experience, people would be more willing to share tangibly valuable information - like phone numbers to direct contacts, software, business systems, mindmaps, etc, under these circumstances...

Maybe a free section, just to test it out, but from my own experience these days the paid forums (some costing me 3 figures a month) produce positive ROI.

One example is a good mailing list swap. Sometimes you might have to pay JV brokers thousands to organize something for you. But on a good forum, you can get that same deal for the price of the monthly membership.

Anyone not willing to pay for valuable information is not someone I probably would end up doing business with anyway - IT'S CALLED THE INFORMATION ECONOMY RIGHT?

I don't know where this whole idea of "paying for information" being stupid that persists on WF comes from....

On a different note, one of the ideas some colleagues and I are toying with are online summits for b2b clients or institutional investors - basically they get to save a plane ticket or better yet, instead of 5 analysts going to a conference, they can listen in on a conference call and still get the info....

This could extended to the b2b digital marketing crowd or Inc5000 crowd for anyone who so desires...
this is a very lucrative market and just yesterday I was on a call with 6 people, 3 continents and was amazed by how well it went....I'm referring to something along the lines of the conferences these guys produce:

Information Management Network (IMN) Global Organizers of Institutional Finance & Investment Conferences
Click to expand...

^^THIS, charging for it keeps the tire kickers and F#$@!ing idiots and trolls out. I'd be a lot more inclined to reveal useful information if it was only to a select group of people who are actually involved enough to be paying for the right to be there, that weeds out 80% of the crap that would make this fail.
 
mont7071 said:
^^THIS, charging for it keeps the tire kickers and F#$@!ing idiots and trolls out. I'd be a lot more inclined to reveal useful information if it was only to a select group of people who are actually involved enough to be paying for the right to be there, that weeds out 80% of the crap that would make this fail.
Click to expand...

with the forum i started im gunna let everyone in and start with a little bit of quantity. then once we get running i am going to weed out the quality and put them in their own section. no need to pay for communication and gathering
 
mont7071 said:
^^THIS, charging for it keeps the tire kickers and F#$@!ing idiots and trolls out. I'd be a lot more inclined to reveal useful information if it was only to a select group of people who are actually involved enough to be paying for the right to be there, that weeds out 80% of the crap that would make this fail.
Click to expand...

This.

Not many actually pay the $70 to join ours, nor do we advertise it (but enough do find it anyway and pay - and they see the value instantly - no bs posts - anywhere), as stated the fee acts as a gateway filter to get rid of idiots proactively before they sign up, and it works. Nobody is going to pay to be an idiot, I've banned maybe x people out of 3300 so far.

Good to see you guys opening up to the digital realm and being a vendor, there's tons of opportunity with the digital networks not just CB. Never think 'ebook douche-bag' either - it's just 'whatever you can deliver off a server' or membership sites/software/video/audio, and yes, .pdf's. Now CB is actually integrating tangible ship/handle offers too.
 
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