IMO pretty much all discussion about affiliate programs should be between the affiliate and the network. I can't understand why anyone would discuss the offers they're running on a public forum. Only hurting themselves. If I were an advertiser I would be really paranoid about my offer becoming popular, then having all the newbies on forums like this start discussing it... then all of them start running it... people start trying to scam it... offer turns to shit. This forum is really 1/2 beneficial and 1/2 detrimental for affiliate marketing.
Anyone sick of scrubs? We are.
- Thread starter affiliatearmy
- Start date
networks already take a cut of the CPA... there's no reason for them to shave a few dollars at random. i imagine such a thing would be pretty difficult to program as well.
Cmon thats ridiculous. Unless you're talking about fraud leads most Advertisers I know want as much traffic as they can get their hands are. Theyre in control - if they receive shit from any of us they'll simply tell the network to ask us to stop marketing, I've had it happen before where my traffic wasnt backing out, the Advertiser contacted the network, they asked me to stop promoting, which I did, reluctantly.
I am trying to understand your reasoning why an advertiser would FEAR his offer becoming popular, anywhere. Even here.. some of the brightest minds and hottest marketers are here (as well as the darkest of dark and evil, sure...) You will never be able to prove shaving on any level unless you get a few friends with CCs together and do some random purchases and compare results. And even then, let's say you found evidence of shaving... if I was running that offer and making a killing, do you think I would stop running it? Proof is only good for applying pressure from the network to the advertisers. I'm an advocate of doing it still, but it cant be in our control for leverage purposes.
To the guy who suggested the live chat window, how the hell are you gonna get your chat window on an Advertiser's site? Or did you mean through the network, so once the network link is clicked, the window pops up? If an Advertiser sees that you know they'll freak out right? I doubt any network would touch that idea with a 10 foot pole.
In other words, you're suggesting that the advertiser pester the shit out of the potential lead/customer and essentially interfere with the process as they're trying to sign up for an offer? I think somewhere in sales & marketing 101 it mentions that if someone wants to buy something from you, get out of the way and let 'em buy it. Id you want a user to perform a particular action on a page, don't distract them away from doing so.
It's for the greater good, I can afford to sacrifice a few sales to find out valuable information. Of course its going to lower your actual sales for the time you do it, that's common sense, but the ones that go through and do talk to you will certainly help you find out if the offer is honest with the leads or not.
This is exactly how I see shaving, I could really care less what the shave is just what the EPC is and how much my ROI. If an offer tanks on EPC with the same traffic it's just time to find a new offer. The only reason I care is because I'm always curious how other businesses are doing and if there is good money to be made by me entering it.
Also shaving is always going to be part of this industry I would say for this for one very good reason, you can't change a payout without pissing people off.
In any good management program you will learn keeping salaries low and boosting moral with bonuses and extras is a great way to go. If the business falls on hard times the worst thing that can be done is pay cuts, taking away a bonus or free lunches might be the exact same thing but won't lower morally nearly as much.
The same thing goes for an offer, lowering the payout is a sure fire way to kill the traffic coming to the offer. Shaving enough to lower everyone's EPC as much as a payout decrease won't cause as many affiliates to drop the offer. So when faced with the choice of having to adjust a payout and shave, well I can see why they make the choice they do.
Heh, the issue here is that the advertisers should not buy leads if they don't have a good model in place. If they are only paying on leads that have an acceptable "rebill rate", maybe they should just pay a big bounty for SALES. A lead is not a fucking sale. I have sold 100 leads to two firms simultaneously (shared) and one company gets 10 deals and the other 0. Some advertisers just suck.
It's simply far too easy for a merchant to claim the leads aren't good. Having sold a shit ton of leads in more traditional industries I need to know exactly why every lead is returned - without exception.
It's simply far too easy for a merchant to claim the leads aren't good. Having sold a shit ton of leads in more traditional industries I need to know exactly why every lead is returned - without exception.
You're over analyzing. Unless you are married to 1 or 2 offers, which would explain why you need to know every lead's status (or you're only banking a few leads per day), it makes no sense to worry about it. Your banking portfiolio should consist of 2-3 dozen solid offers.
Look at your EPCs, if you are making a profit, that's all that matters.
Look at this way as well, the Advertiser is offering higher payouts to attract your business. So let's say you're getting $35 a lead/sale... and let's assume 1 out of 10 leads is being shaved. Do the math and you may find you're still making good when you consider the advertiser could have capped the sale at $25/head vs. $35.
I'd like to prove shaving simply out of curiosities sake, and to ease my mind when I see 600 clicks and -2- sales some day, and I scream into the monitor "What the FUCK!". Inevitably, the next day I get 600 clicks on the same offer and 10-15 sales, and maybe the next day 300 clicks and 20 sales, so I chalk it up to the mystical force of the phase of the moon at the time the person is on the landing page.
Why do you think some networks have private offers?
1. Usually because it's new and they want to analyze the metrics and tweak it.
2. They're not too heavy in the cash department
3. Limited inventory, so they don't want too many backorders.
4. Would rather have the network's give to their top producers who are solid so they don't have to deal with fraud as much.
I totally understand the above, but a lot of the BIG advertisers, with tons of revolving cc authorization companies, inventory, support staff, and infrastructure, will get as much as they can, while they can.
Take the latest Twitter bizopp offer for example. About every network I know ran it, knowing Twitter would send a C&D, just to get as much volume possible before being forced to pull it down. It's almost like a chop shop mentality, sales flood in from as many sources as possible until they're forced to close, then they move to the next offer.
Limited windows = max possible volume.
Wonder- I dont get it...help..
I too run biz opps with Ruck...and have seen Works and Lightning et al go up and down...but what do you mean with <title> tags...what does that have to do with the shaving.....
When Ruck had google Red, one day we sent $2800 worth of traffic to get ZERO fucking conversions...
Thx Brian
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I too run biz opps with Ruck...and have seen Works and Lightning et al go up and down...but what do you mean with <title> tags...what does that have to do with the shaving.....
When Ruck had google Red, one day we sent $2800 worth of traffic to get ZERO fucking conversions...
Thx Brian