Did Whitey Invent Racism Based Slavery?

WickedJoe

WickedJoe

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I was talking to a history major today who believes that racism-based slavery is a new thing in human history invented by whitey in the last 300-400 yrs. This is what she was taught. I was surprised she believed this because it sounds utterly ridiculous to me. We often even joke around on this forum that this is what is being taught in schools.

So what this comes down to is that she can't name any other examples in history of a civilization keeping another 'race' enslaved perpetually because they are that race. And I can't really name any examples either because I don't study ancient history.

I mentioned that the Jew's enslavement in Egypt could be an example but, after looking it up, there is no proof it ever actually happened. Only the Torah/Bible mentions it. And she didn't agree that Jews are even necessarily a separate race from Egyptians of the time.

The word 'race' has had different meanings throughout history but these days it mostly means groups of people with different physical characteristics.

So, if anyone is a history buff or can help - I just need an example of an ancient civilization that had institutionalized slavery of a group of people based on certain different physical characteristics of those people (race). It would also mean their progeny would officially be enslaved forever as well - with no hope of gained freedom from the state.

Personally, knowing humans and their capacity for manipulation and hatred for each other, there's no question in my mind that there had to be some race based slavery - if not lots of it. For example, there had to have been some war in the past between two different civs of two different races of people. Then the victor race enslaved the other race and slavery was based on enslaving that different race after that (Racism based slavery). But all my Google searches keep bringing up nothing but the hundreds of thousands of papers written on African enslavement by whitey.
 


Were there whites for sale in that time? No? Supply and demand. Africans were putting up other Africans up for sale. Money be green.

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[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31E1gHowYcA[/ame]
 
The bible, the torah, the koran, all cover slavery from far before America was known. Most of the slaves were foreigners to the people that owned them. Many from Africa and the Middle East.
 
Slavery has been an active part of human history. When you captured your rivals town, you burned it, killed the men, and enslaved the women and children. It was considered insane to leave an enemy at your footstep.

I have a son headed to university and it scares the shit out of me how screwed up our educational system has gotten.
 
Race-based slavery was pretty much an invention of the United States (and by "race-based," I mean slavery that's justified through racist beliefs).

After all, how do you reconcile the fact that you own people in a country that champions freedom?

Well... You rationalize it by dehumanizing your human property. If your slaves aren't fully human, you aren't obligated to treat them like humans. But you can't convincingly do this if your "property" is the same race as you. That's one of the reasons indentured servants typically had it a little easier than full-on black slaves.

But yeah - like another member said, race is pretty much a social construct with a loose biological basis. Read Thomas Sowell's "Intellectuals and Race" [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Intellectuals-Race-Thomas-Sowell/dp/0465058728"]Link:[/ame] to see how the shitty concept of genetic determinism in the late 19th century and early 20th century really set the tone for modern day racism.
 
Thanks guys, there's a lot of info for me to look at here. She definitely doesn't believe that whiteman invented slavery.. only institutionalized race-based slavery (slavery justified by racist beliefs). She thinks slaves of the past were usually gotten by just being conquered, captured, indebted, etc and that race had little to nothing to do about it.

So the Irish Slave trading is interesting but the question is are the Irish a different race than the English. Or do they have distinguishing physical features where you could pick them out in a crowd among Englishmen? I think most would say no. Red hair and freckles is prevalent throughout Europe and the UK.

I'm still looking at the other stuff.

Gimpsack has the right idea of what she believes. But to him I'd say there has to have been other times in history where slaves have been 'dehumanized' by their masters based on their race (physical differences in appearance).
 
Aristotle's theory of slavery holds that some people are naturally slaves and others are naturally masters. Thus he says:

For that some should rule and others be ruled is a thing not only necessary, but expedient; from the hour of their birth, some are marked out for subjection, others for rule.

Aristotle on Slavery
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Hard to know the context from history books, even US history has disagreement on a number of things, and it'd be interesting to read about it from the perspective a few hundred years from now.


Regarding the US:
Robert Fogel argued that the material conditions of slaves were better than those of free industrial workers. While slaves' living conditions were poor by modern standards, Fogel emphasized that all workers during the first half of the 19th century were subject to hardship.

In a survey, 58% of historians and 42% of economists disagreed with Fogel's proposition.
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Ok I still haven't gone through all the info yet but I think the example of the Trans-Sahara Slave Trade (and East African Slave Trade) of blacks by Arabs shows an example of racism based slavery. This is exactly as I would expect because it's a place where different races are near each other.

- black men/boys were castrated immediately based on racist beliefs about black men's sexual behavior and sold as eunuchs
- SURVIVAL rate from this castration was only between 1 in 10 to 1 in 30. Survival Rate!
- If a black slave women had a baby, it was murdered, even if the father was the master.

Scholars have noticed very little black population in Arab countries even after 14 centuries of black slavery there. This is unlike other countries that had black slaves that now have a large black population. This because of mandatory castration of black men and killing of black children (even mixed). If this isn't racism i don't know what is.

Now, about the Irish slavery. Irish Slavery is probably not an example of race-based slavery but it does show that North American Slavery was very possibly not race based at all.. because we had black and white slaves coexisting at the same time in America. So once again there is probably nothing special or more evil about American slavery historically.
 
Woot, I win. She conceded. She just needed an example. She's not against going against commonly taught dogma, but just needed a solid example because this shit isn't taught of course.

Thanks for the help guys

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It's hard for me to say.

I am thinking yes that whitey did invent race-based slavery though not sure but the idea fits with some other things I have heard.
 
WickedJoe said:
Ok I still haven't gone through all the info yet but I think the example of the Trans-Sahara Slave Trade (and East African Slave Trade) of blacks by Arabs shows an example of racism based slavery. This is exactly as I would expect because it's a place where different races are near each other.

- black men/boys were castrated immediately based on racist beliefs about black men's sexual behavior and sold as eunuchs
- SURVIVAL rate from this castration was only between 1 in 10 to 1 in 30. Survival Rate!
- If a black slave women had a baby, it was murdered, even if the father was the master.

Scholars have noticed very little black population in Arab countries even after 14 centuries of black slavery there. This is unlike other countries that had black slaves that now have a large black population. This because of mandatory castration of black men and killing of black children (even mixed). If this isn't racism i don't know what is.

Now, about the Irish slavery. Irish Slavery is probably not an example of race-based slavery but it does show that North American Slavery was very possibly not race based at all.. because we had black and white slaves coexisting at the same time in America. So once again there is probably nothing special or more evil about American slavery historically.
Click to expand...

Yeah the bold was my point. Sorry for a lack of clarification.
 
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bUo7UQrx_g[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfuOzSWtxRw[/ame]
 
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