Fuck you WickedFire. Fuck you Right in the ass!

On a more serious note, I think the easy money dried up years ago. You have to remember, years ago banks were handing out credit cards like candy, so getting people to purchase was much easier, since they didn't view it as their money. Plus back then there was a BARRAGE of "be your own boss" infomercials and ads and other shit being constantly shoved in your face, which you don't really see any more.

I'm here more by force, not choice. I don't even have grade 10, let alone a high school diploma, so for me it's sink or swim. Aside from software, I'm qualified to stock shelves at Walmart, or dig a hole. I spent about a year re-training myself, and am extremely glad I did, because I now have clients literally forcing triple my going rate (my rate it quite decent to begin with) on me, just to make sure I stick with them. Granted, I'm basically just an employee, but I'm not complaining.

Couldn't imagine starting up another small SaaS, or selling some distributable software again, or whatever. It's just not worth it. At the end of the day, you're hauling ass to no end, constantly under stress because you're serving hundreds if not thousands of customers, and the money you make just doesn't make it worth it. Best to go with behind-the-scenes deals with wealthy individuals / companies.
 


Kiopa_Matt said:
Plus back then there was a BARRAGE of "be your own boss" infomercials and ads and other shit being constantly shoved in your face, which you don't really see any more.
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That's mostly because the economy is currently in its upward part of the cycle. Wait till the next crash and you'll have desperate people looking for Government Grants and Bizopps all over again. Lot's of things change, but people never do.
 
bluechinagroup said:
Somebody's jimmies are rustled.

I build and run my own offers. I think that's much more stable and profitable than JUST doing SEO. I can rely on multiple sources of traffic rather than praying that my sites don't get de-indexed by Google.

Of course SEO plays a role in my business (especially for brand management of my offers), but I can also run large Adwords campaigns, do media buys, email campaigns, etc. I have eggs in multiple baskets, and when the next big G animal comes along I barely notice it.

I'm glad that there are SEO guys making huge bank. But you're being too narrow minded if you're JUST focusing on SEO.
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Jimmies definitely not rustled and I can 100% agree with you about diversifying. I just don't agree that SEOs are the bottom tier on the marketing food chain.
 
Not sure how many people here promote Clickbank stuff, but anyone remembers the 800-900 gravity days?

Look at their marketplace now...Just over 300 for the top product.

It's quite obvious G has evolved over the years, so there's not so much discussion about "the latest tricks" to get ranked, because most of us know that it's all temporary bullshit.

Possibly 4-5 years ago, when Google didn't hate marketers/affiliates so much and the competition wasn't so huge, you could rely on SEO for some "long-term" results and even random knobheads could write a few articles, submit to EA and get ranked...

The wall got thicker and the entry barrier got raised, which is good and bad...but yeah, all Google to blame...

/moaning
 
dmnEPC said:
Nope there's nothing like it. I've been getting sucked into reddit, but it's got this really pretentious vibe to it. I've been spending the past couple months working on self improvement. Taking my eating and excersise much more serious. And also made a daily commitment to improving my coding skills, as well as some creative expression(writting, and art). And I have found some great communities to help me out. But even those have that fake pretentiousness. Maybe it's me. Maybe WF has jaded me.

There is nothing I would love more than healthy vibrant WF
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Same here, I have been working on self development (nothing to do with bullshit self dev blogs and videos). Could you PM me these communities? I really need to improve my public speaking skills.
 
charlesmartel said:
igkfn8.jpg
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If it's not meat, it's not a meal.
 
Flash4Ever said:
Same here, I have been working on self development (nothing to do with bullshit self dev blogs and videos). Could you PM me these communities? I really need to improve my public speaking skills.
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NO need for a PM. I have found 2 places with shockingly active communities.

Facebook Groups
This is by for one of the most amazing things on the inter webs. I know, I know. I have tried to avoid Facebook for years. I still don't post much to my "timeline". But I have been using the shit out of their groups. They are basically just Facebook forums. The best ones are very niche specific and usually private. I can't tell you how life changing some of these groups can be. I have found them especially useful for learning and my creative endeavors.

Oh and once you become part of the community, they can be an absolute gold mine for selling physical products (I'm sure you could sell anything). However do not make that your intention. You really have to become part of the group. If they think you're just there to fuck them like a cheap whore on dollar night, you will be ostracized from the group faster than a 16 year old boy cums on prom night.

Also niche specific sub reddit. They are vey similar to the FB groups. Just keep in mind you can get into the fake pretentiousness in these groups. They can be really "cliquey" as well.

Just like on WF, the real benefit comes from the private discussions. WF has plenty of private Skype groups which can solve just about any problem. By nurturing those public relationships in private, can and will go a long way to improving your satisfaction with the group. I can't empasize this enough. Take the discussions out of the public and PM members you admire. If you see someone having a problem, go out of your way to solve it. Have private conversations. There are so many advantages to doing this. You never know when you will need to call on this private secret army.

That's it. Be yourself, be active, be social, and don't fuck people over.
 
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Fatbat said:
Not everyone here doing design is a $5 logo kiddie from fiverr. There are quite a few making decent money at this.
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Not saying there isn't money in it. I look at amount of profits from a time value standpoint. How much time did it take you to make X amount of dollars versus how much time you spent on the project. Many times it's very low. Add in the customer service side of it and you have a ton of headaches.

I wasn't trying to talk shit on anyone's gig. Simply disagreed with Bluechip's view that SEOs were the lowest tier in the industry.
 
jstover77 said:
I wasn't trying to talk shit on anyone's gig. Simply disagreed with Bluechip's view that SEOs were the lowest tier in the industry.
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Yet the same point you're making about SEO is said about most industries, including what you're implying about design. You will get paid based on the value you bring, whatever matter the source of that value. A logo in the real world isn't cheap, unless you like derivative shit.
 
dmnEPC said:
That not very far off from what I've been doing. Add some cheese, eggs, coconut oil to your list and watch the fat melt away. I have had so much clarity since I've killed the carbs. It's almost like being high.
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Add some acai berry to that diet and you'll be a brand new man! While we're at it, can I also interest you in a lap band? :food-smiley-010:

That being said, I've found that the private Skype groups have been awesome as aforementioned, plus they're a lot more active. I find myself coming to WF to dig through some old gems to build a good foundation as well as coming to STS for some occasional keks. Overall I haven't been here long enough to feel the difference of the "golden age" but I can tell from old threads how much more active this place was. Really though it's just a sign of the times- as options become more fragmented and less obvious, so do the groups that work with them.
 
BigWill said:
. I just come back to read the grunnin thread. lol.
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This. + I'm just here to post animated WWE Gifs & BRC updates.

Every other thread on WF is Kiopa acting like he knows everything, durka durkas selling BST shit, or others talking about stupid crap like BTC or political shit they have no clue about.

ric-flair-flop-o.gif
 
WF started falling off in 2010 when CPA affiliate marketing died. The SEO people were just the only ones that stuck around after that gravy train was over. Once Grunin gets thrown in jail WF is just going to be Galacon yelling racial slurs into empty space.
 
aeisn said:
WF started falling off in 2010 when CPA affiliate marketing died. The SEO people were just the only ones that stuck around after that gravy train was over. Once Grunin gets thrown in jail WF is just going to be Galacon yelling racial slurs into empty space.
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Affiliate marketing is still alive. I have plenty of good affiliates. It's just dead for your typical mediocre landing page ripping loser who was "on the bubble" in the first place.

It's good that these people are gone.
 
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