Got 'em!!
- Thread starter Jon
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Getting there. I have to drive to phoenix in the morning to find a new house.
Haven't read the whole 13 pages, but having hair longer than a bitch should be illegal and he needs his ass beat just for that.
Sorry for not responding earlier, was at a friend's wedding all evening, but after reading SPF and the posts here, I have decided to comment on everything at one shot, so here goes..
First off, after reviewing my original threat, I have to say, that was uncool of me, and I take it back. Why should his ass be kicked when I can fuck him financially instead?
Second, before leaving to my friend's wedding tonight I paid some cash to speak to a few different lawyers at some firms that specialize in trademark/domain squatting. Two reasons I went for a few of them, one is because since I brought the case in hand to them, now Gary/Matt cannot use them for representation, and second because I wanted to get a negative response or be told "no, you have no case". Well guess what. All of them said in so many words "You are a clear winner, the guys would be foolish to go up against you in court for it" -- Not to mention, the fact that they had linked to competitors, I can also seek damages, which wouldn't be more than $10k, but still, $10k + the domains wouldn't be a bad deal PLUS they would have to pay for my lawyers and theirs too. So now that I know I am in a very good position with the law and this domain mess, I clearly have the upper hand.
Some more good news, they all agreed that I can also sue Freshcoders.com because the domain squatter openly admitted not only on IM's but on his blog and in email messages that people had sent to me in regards to this mess that he clearly stated he was the owner of the company. Running a company can also be defined as owning it. Not to mention he also admitted that he was using the domains for malicious reasons, so he's pretty fucked on that part. Good job Gary!
Now for Matt and his completely retarded comments of not understand WHY his company is involved.. Your employee Gary said he owned your company and "runs the company" which can also mean owns it, even though he said he owns it already. You were dragged into this because you are also claiming you can't control him, but you expect to control me? Do I work for you? No. Have we ever spoken before? No. Do you pay me for work? No. Do you pay Gary? Yes. Do you have direct contact with Gary? Yes. Are you aware of Gary listing your company domain name under his "Sites I own" list on his blog? Yes. So in turn, you are officially part of the issue, whether you like it or not. Thems the rules, and I am, by law, allowed to sue you. Ask any lawyer, they will tell you the same. Does it suck to be dragged into this (even though I'm pretty convinced you knew about it all along but now you're trying to play the helpless victim role), yes, it does suck, but hey, if you can't control the actions that your employees take, and you're willing to stand up for them even when everyone around you, both peers and lawyers are saying HE IS AT FAULT, then you ultimately become part of the mess. It's nothing personal, just business.
Finally, I am going to give Gary or Matt, one last chance to hand over both domains, the wickedfire.net and the wickedfire.org before I seek the legal route. I can assure you, I have the money to front for it until you lose and are forced to pay it back (or worse, your parents will). I will drag this on for as long as it takes until I get the domains back. I will make it my life's mission to do so.
OR...
You can be smart about it, cut your losses, and hand over the domains, and in turn, I will remove all of your personal information posted here, and will forget all of this even happened.
All of the lawyers advised me that I should give you one last chance to comply before seeking out legal action, so since they do this for a living, I'll take their advice and do it. You have until Friday, December 29th at 4:00 PM EST to comply. If I don't get an answer by then, I'm suing both Freshcoders.com (Matt) and Gary, or your parents I guess. I will also dedicate a small team of employees into contacting your host providers to let them know what you are involved in, and I will take every creative, but legal approach to getting those domains from you for NO FEE whatsoever. You can either give it up, or take the risk of losing a lot of money and still giving up the domains. The choice should be crystal clear.
It's your move guys...
PS - I had also mentioned the paid threats on Gary to my regular lawyer, and he said, as long as I make it official (which I am now) that I apologized for it, and that I mean no physical harm to the boy, then I am in the clear. Again, I admit, it was a dumb mistake on my part and since I'm here in the US and you are there in the UK, I cannot be held liable for any accidents or physical/psychological damages you may get thrown your way, it would just be a coincidence, and would have NOTHING to do with me.
I've apologized and pretty much laid out what I plan on doing, so if you want to be mature too, now is your chance. After the due date, I will go forward with the legal plans, however long or expensive it may be, and will seek financial damages from Gary and Matt for every penny spent on this after the due date.
First off, after reviewing my original threat, I have to say, that was uncool of me, and I take it back. Why should his ass be kicked when I can fuck him financially instead?
Second, before leaving to my friend's wedding tonight I paid some cash to speak to a few different lawyers at some firms that specialize in trademark/domain squatting. Two reasons I went for a few of them, one is because since I brought the case in hand to them, now Gary/Matt cannot use them for representation, and second because I wanted to get a negative response or be told "no, you have no case". Well guess what. All of them said in so many words "You are a clear winner, the guys would be foolish to go up against you in court for it" -- Not to mention, the fact that they had linked to competitors, I can also seek damages, which wouldn't be more than $10k, but still, $10k + the domains wouldn't be a bad deal PLUS they would have to pay for my lawyers and theirs too. So now that I know I am in a very good position with the law and this domain mess, I clearly have the upper hand.
Some more good news, they all agreed that I can also sue Freshcoders.com because the domain squatter openly admitted not only on IM's but on his blog and in email messages that people had sent to me in regards to this mess that he clearly stated he was the owner of the company. Running a company can also be defined as owning it. Not to mention he also admitted that he was using the domains for malicious reasons, so he's pretty fucked on that part. Good job Gary!
Now for Matt and his completely retarded comments of not understand WHY his company is involved.. Your employee Gary said he owned your company and "runs the company" which can also mean owns it, even though he said he owns it already. You were dragged into this because you are also claiming you can't control him, but you expect to control me? Do I work for you? No. Have we ever spoken before? No. Do you pay me for work? No. Do you pay Gary? Yes. Do you have direct contact with Gary? Yes. Are you aware of Gary listing your company domain name under his "Sites I own" list on his blog? Yes. So in turn, you are officially part of the issue, whether you like it or not. Thems the rules, and I am, by law, allowed to sue you. Ask any lawyer, they will tell you the same. Does it suck to be dragged into this (even though I'm pretty convinced you knew about it all along but now you're trying to play the helpless victim role), yes, it does suck, but hey, if you can't control the actions that your employees take, and you're willing to stand up for them even when everyone around you, both peers and lawyers are saying HE IS AT FAULT, then you ultimately become part of the mess. It's nothing personal, just business.
Finally, I am going to give Gary or Matt, one last chance to hand over both domains, the wickedfire.net and the wickedfire.org before I seek the legal route. I can assure you, I have the money to front for it until you lose and are forced to pay it back (or worse, your parents will). I will drag this on for as long as it takes until I get the domains back. I will make it my life's mission to do so.
OR...
You can be smart about it, cut your losses, and hand over the domains, and in turn, I will remove all of your personal information posted here, and will forget all of this even happened.
All of the lawyers advised me that I should give you one last chance to comply before seeking out legal action, so since they do this for a living, I'll take their advice and do it. You have until Friday, December 29th at 4:00 PM EST to comply. If I don't get an answer by then, I'm suing both Freshcoders.com (Matt) and Gary, or your parents I guess. I will also dedicate a small team of employees into contacting your host providers to let them know what you are involved in, and I will take every creative, but legal approach to getting those domains from you for NO FEE whatsoever. You can either give it up, or take the risk of losing a lot of money and still giving up the domains. The choice should be crystal clear.
It's your move guys...
PS - I had also mentioned the paid threats on Gary to my regular lawyer, and he said, as long as I make it official (which I am now) that I apologized for it, and that I mean no physical harm to the boy, then I am in the clear. Again, I admit, it was a dumb mistake on my part and since I'm here in the US and you are there in the UK, I cannot be held liable for any accidents or physical/psychological damages you may get thrown your way, it would just be a coincidence, and would have NOTHING to do with me.
I've apologized and pretty much laid out what I plan on doing, so if you want to be mature too, now is your chance. After the due date, I will go forward with the legal plans, however long or expensive it may be, and will seek financial damages from Gary and Matt for every penny spent on this after the due date.
Wow- I am so glad Jon posted that at the end of this thread (so far) otherwise I would feel like I just wasted an hour of my life reading though all 14 pages... oh wait I still do.
But Jon- an idea for you... how much do you value your time at? can you statistically back this up? Why not keep track of how many hours you devote to this case and then seek damages in that sense, as well as any other sense you were already planning on.
Matt and Gary- coming from someone who isn't a 'fan boi' of Jon's (I do respect him though) just give up the domains. What can you possibly seek to gain from keeping them?
But Jon- an idea for you... how much do you value your time at? can you statistically back this up? Why not keep track of how many hours you devote to this case and then seek damages in that sense, as well as any other sense you were already planning on.
Matt and Gary- coming from someone who isn't a 'fan boi' of Jon's (I do respect him though) just give up the domains. What can you possibly seek to gain from keeping them?
They'll have about 2.5 days to think about it, and realize that it's not a joke, and that I'm taking this very seriously. It started out as a joke on their part, on now it's becoming a lot more serious, not to mention Gary brought in two sites already that had nothing to do with it at first. Even though I don't like Peter Davis, he's been quite helpful and I'm not blaming him for any of this either, because he really was an innocent bystander, but I don't know if I can say the same for Freshcoders.com. Either way, they can go contact a lawyer about it, and maybe he'll tell them "it's not worth the battle, just cut your losses (which is $16 or so) and give up the domains"..
Hmmm.. Losing $16 vs losing $10k+ AND the domains... tough choice..
CLKeenan, if Jon has the law on his side, and the end result of going to court is getting his domains, legal fees and possibly damages, then the time issue is irrelevant. Also, how much time do you think he is going to have to invest in this personally? Not much once he sicks his sharks on those kids. That's why you shell out the cash for a lawyer. They do all the leg work, etc.
Just a thought. Personally, I'm finding this whole situation ludicrous, as those two guys are clinging to about $16 (in reg fees) worth of domains just to look macho. If anybody ever finds anything copyrighted on one of my sites and simply asks, it's gone.
Let's put this a different way...imagine Sony only owned Sony.com, and somebody unrelated to Sony buys Sony.net and points the domain to Panasonic.com. You can bet your ass, Sony won't hesitate to sick the dogs on them. Copyright / trademark infringement is still copyright / trademark infringement whether you are talking about Sony, Microsoft, Dell, or WickedFire.
Just a thought. Personally, I'm finding this whole situation ludicrous, as those two guys are clinging to about $16 (in reg fees) worth of domains just to look macho. If anybody ever finds anything copyrighted on one of my sites and simply asks, it's gone.
Let's put this a different way...imagine Sony only owned Sony.com, and somebody unrelated to Sony buys Sony.net and points the domain to Panasonic.com. You can bet your ass, Sony won't hesitate to sick the dogs on them. Copyright / trademark infringement is still copyright / trademark infringement whether you are talking about Sony, Microsoft, Dell, or WickedFire.
If they would have asked "can I use this domain for blah blah" that would have been an entirely different story, and chances are I would have said no regardless, and paid for the domains too. But being that they were used for malicious acts on purpose, and then flaunted as a "oh look what I did" type of thing, then of course that would piss the owner off. And for your reference, Sony wouldn't come to a forum to announce it, instead they would have sent a shitload of press releases out and had tons of news reporters cover it as well. They vent in their ways, I vent in mine.
This is stupid, I've known Indy for a while over at TalkFreelance, and he isn't a bad guy.
Just go to his house and arm wrestle him for the domains - judging from both of your guys pictures, it will be a good match.
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Also... Why didn't you buy the .net and .org when you registered the .com? It seems like a pretty basic move these days to prevent problems such as these.
Just go to his house and arm wrestle him for the domains - judging from both of your guys pictures, it will be a good match.
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Also... Why didn't you buy the .net and .org when you registered the .com? It seems like a pretty basic move these days to prevent problems such as these.
Enough of this shit.. I've banned Matt and Gary, and will ban their instigating cronies too. I've given my ultimatum, and both Matt and Gary can contact me on AIM with an answer. This thread is being closed, and I'll report on the final answer after the deadline passes for all of your drama addicts.
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