Retirement Accounts

[AdHustler]

Im not sure what retirement accounts you are using but people must be confused or not make as much as they let on

Income limit on a roth IRA is 112k-127k for single Income Limits Updated for 2013

Income limit to take a deduction (hence the reason for locking the money in a retirement account) on traditional IRA is 60-70k AGI. iracontributionlimits2010

? ? ?

 

[c4yrslf12]

What's so crazy about their fee schedule? Granted, it's not ING Direct or anything, but those are competitive rates. I've never used them, because it only makes sense if you have a good $1mil+ to invest, and well... I just don't have that much money. I know people who have used them though, and sounded like they were great. Very attentive, put together a custom portfolio for you, stay on top of the markets, have access to massive resources, are around for personal consultations whenever you desire, etc.

Dig deeper, my friend.

We want you to understand that Edward Jones' receipt of revenue-sharing payments represents a potential conflict of interest in the form of additional financial incentive and financial benefit to the firm, its financial advisors and equity owners in connection with the sale of products from these partners.

They were required to lay this out after not disclosing fees to the SEC, somewhere to the tune of like $100M if I remember right.

But you are correct, people have done well with them. I cannot disagree there.

 

[I_like_cock]

What's so crazy about their fee schedule? Granted, it's not ING Direct or anything, but those are competitive rates. I've never used them, because it only makes sense if you have a good $1mil+ to invest, and well... I just don't have that much money. I know people who have used them though, and sounded like they were great. Very attentive, put together a custom portfolio for you, stay on top of the markets, have access to massive resources, are around for personal consultations whenever you desire, etc.

 

[Kiopa_Matt]

They were required to lay this out after not disclosing fees to the SEC, somewhere to the tune of like $100M if I remember right.

But you are correct, people have done well with them. I cannot disagree there.

Ahhh, didn't know that one. Did a quick search, but couldn't find anything. Do you by chance know, was there a difference in policy between US and Canada based clients, as Canada does tend to have more stringent regulation? If so, that would explain why I've never heard of a complaint about them.

 

[c4yrslf12]

Ahhh, didn't know that one. Did a quick search, but couldn't find anything. Do you by chance know, was there a difference in policy between US and Canada based clients, as Canada does tend to have more stringent regulation? If so, that would explain why I've never heard of a complaint about them.

SEC.gov

Historically, over 95% of Edward Jones’ sales of mutual fund shares have been sales of the seven Preferred Families.

At the same time, Edward Jones failed to disclose that it received tens of millions of dollars from the Preferred Families each year, on top of commissions and other fees, for selling their mutual funds.

 

[I_like_cock]

My trick for valuing a retirement account is to look at the tax differential that you'll be 'earning' by putting the money into the retirement account, rather than a savings account. This means that they are only worth your time if you are in a high tax bracket now, and will be in a low tax bracket when you retire.

Take your current tax rate, and subtract the minimum tax bracket (15-20%) in your jurisdiction. Divide that number by the number of years until your retirement. This is the annual benefit of the retirement account. If its <3%, its not worth it, go buy a bond and keep access to the funds outside the retirement account. If its >3%, its starting to become worthwhile.

Anyone looking to invest for retirement should ignore this. The whole reason why you have IRA accounts it to save on the taxes yearly that will rape your dividends, reinvestment, and the power of compounding interest.

Im not sure what retirement accounts you are using but people must be confused or not make as much as they let on

Income limit on a roth IRA is 112k-127k for single Income Limits Updated for 2013

Income limit to take a deduction (hence the reason for locking the money in a retirement account) on traditional IRA is 60-70k AGI. iracontributionlimits2010

? ? ?

Everyone here should have some type of IRA no matter what they earn. I would recommend both Roth & traditional IRA or SEP-IRA.

Roth IRA's are great because if you make under $191K, I think in 2014 that's the limit, you can contribute $5,500 a year. You will not receive a tax break on it the year you contribute BUT when you invest those yearly contributions the ROTH is exempt from all income taxes for dividends & capital gains for the life of the account and even when you take distributions at 70 1/2 letting the compounding interest principle take effect.

And even millionaires can have traditional IRA account's - 2014 IRA Contribution and Deduction Limits - Effect of Modified AGI on Deductible Contributions if You are NOT Covered by a Retirement Plan at Work

If you don't have 30+ hours/week to spend on market research, then either just go with a firm like Edward Jones, or dump your money into Vanguard 500.

PS. You do realize that asking this on WF is the blind leading the blind, right? You might as well just go to Starbucks, and ask the barrister where you should invest your money.

I would listen to your own advice. Stick to programming buddy! :drinkup: Recommending Edward Jones is one of the worst pieces of financial advice you could post on this forum. The only reason they are in business is to take naive people's $$$ for retirement and transfer it to their pockets. 90% of people don't know or think this cus they aren't writing EDJ an actual check... their "Very attentive, personal advisor *cough* swindlers *cough*" with massive resources put them in a customized portofilo to match their own personal best interests *cough* commissions, promotions, bonus *cough cough* while raping their clients 1-2% AUM fees, putting them in high-load class A funds, 12b-1 fees, & commissions. Those fuckers even hit you with a $95 account closure fee when you smarten up and drop them clowns.

Hell, I'm sure they are really nice people and send their clients all types of perks like a sweet baked ham for Xmas and maybe some game tickets here or there. What's funny is the price of those tickets their clients are a free gift... they just don't realize what they are actually paying for them.

Let's hear from the people who know WTF they are talking about...

This first video is QFT.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idr6c8NHuWs]Buffett's best tip for personal finance - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aegXd0Q1CI]John Bogle: How much do investors lose in charges and management fees? - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDYCwqmH1Ts]Lange-Bogle 3: What Hurts the Everyday Investor Now - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7lizGrBAXM]THE LATEST NEWS : Vanguards Bogle Makes the Case for the Index Fund - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4DREQgRZ6o&list=PLC81743DEAF303639]Jack Bogle: What the Business of Investing Is All About - Morningstar Video - YouTube[/ame]

As someone tagged below... post #3 /end thread hehehehe.

Read this book...

Read these to further your education on long-term investing for retirement:

Investment Books

Browse the Bogleheads forum - Bogleheads • Index page

Seriously... it's best to educated yourself on this shit because ask yourself "who the fuck is gonna give a shit & have your best interest at hand about your assets, wealth, retirement, & $$$ that the person you see in the fucking mirror?"

Even if you do decide this shit is way over your head then take this advice please...

DO NOT USE A AUM CFP aka (Assets Under Management Financial Advisor) go with a Fee-Based CFP.

Read here why:

http://www.hullfinancialplanning.co...ke-getting-a-car-loan-from-a-used-car-dealer/

And that is another reason why I like Vanguard for my retirement accounts... if you have $50,000 in your accounts with them you get a CFP to give you a financial plan for like $100. If you have over $500,000 with them you can have a CFP on the line any time you need him for free. You have more than a mil you even get more sweet perks.

https://investor.vanguard.com/what-we-offer/personal-services/voyager-and-voyager-select-services

Again, my post is only about investing for long-term & retirement. mGrunin, day trading, & speculation is a whole different ball game.

 

[r3p1v]

Some really good general advice in here, but most posts seem to ignore what the OP was asking about. He seems to be worried about the risks and a total collapse of the economy and dollar.

have a feeling that something is going to happen and vaporize everyones shit

So , retirement accounts, is it a sure thing or a crap shoot/?

This is a possibility, but imo extremely unlikely and not worth worrying about. BUT you need to understand the risks involved in stocks, even index funds can lose 50 to 70 percent during a bad recession or depression. I think they lost 89% during the great depression? But historically the stock market has always recovered. And historically, even with these bad downturns, return about 8 to 9 percent a year.

If you are not comfortable with that level or risk or don't understand that this can happen, then you shouldn't be invested in stocks. If you absolutely can't lose the money, don't put it in the market.

No amount of tax savings and fee avoidance is going to help if you freak out when the market is down 50% and sell everything for a 50% loss.

If you actually do want to hedge against a total collapse, what was already mentioned is probably good. Gold, ammo, stuff you could easily sell or trade if there is no financial system or a worthless dollar. I don't know much about this and it's really hard to imagine. Like should you buy physical gold, or a gold etf? idk. What are you going to do with a gold bar in your house, why would anyone buy or trade for that if it doesn't do anything? And if you have a gold etf when the economy totally collapses, there is no guarantee that you will be able to sell it if the banks and internet are down or something. Anyway, this is kind of crazy, I'd just stick to what I_like_cock recommended, and if you are really still worried about a total collapse and want to hedge against it, buy a couple thousand (or few hundred or small percent of your money) worth of physical stuff and put it in your garage I guess.

 

[JakeStratham]

Again, my post is only about investing for long-term & retirement. mGrunin, day trading, & speculation is a whole different ball game.

At the OP: Thus far, this is the most insightful comment in this thread. It should spur you to evaluate your goals. Don't accept conventional wisdom - e.g. dollar cost averaging, buy-and-hold, diversification via funds, etc. - without knowing whether it accommodates whatever you're trying to accomplish with your money.

For example, do you just want to build a nest egg to retire on? If so, you'll need to estimate inflation, your life expectancy, taxes, inflows, the cost of health care, and myriad other expenses, post-retirement. The problem here is that so many variables are uncertain that it's a shot in a dark.

Do you want to emulate guys like Cuban and O'Leary? Keep in mind, you don't need billions to invest in businesses. But you do need to be savvy about taxes, contracts, and business operations (I'm not talking about mom-and-pop shops).

Also, if you're building something that others will buy, you might be better offer investing your cash into that venture rather than putting it into a tax-deferred vehicle. (It might be interesting to hear Eduardo's thoughts on this.)

If you're investing to survive the zombie apocalypse, then buy guns, ammo, and samurai swords (gotta lop off the heads).

 

[qibrandmgmt]

This book looks awesome. Do you recommend reading The Black Swan first?

Its not necessary, I wish I would have read this one first...would have helped my understand The Black Swan better I think. May re-read that one...

 

[Hurr-Durr]

lmao...

 

[keeper33]

No amount of tax savings and fee avoidance is going to help if you freak out when the market is down 50% and sell everything for a 50% loss.

I've never understood this mentality. A downturn in the market can be such a great buying opportunity.

As for the guy who mentioned oil wells - those can be sweet investments. Many of the opportunities require that one is an accredited investor (>$200k per annum & >$1MM assets) though.

 

[zxcvb]

If you have the time: Put all your eggs in the best basket. Watch that basket every day.

Listen to Warren Buffett: Watch 0:42 - 1:28.
​

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbjPiYE-F4Y]Warren Buffett ~ Diversification - YouTube[/ame]​

Same advice, from Mark Cuban:
​

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5Pp1HEKSPM"]Cuban on Investing: Diversification Is for Idiots - YouTube[/ame]​