The Illogic of Atheism? (if you like math and logic - no bible quotes pls)
- Thread starter riddarhusetgal
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KICK ASS QUESTION. I remember asking my slightly religious science teacher that in junior high/high school.
What makes sense to me is a concept close to that which science defines energy as - something that can neither be:
i) created
ii) destroyed
So if you have something that i) cannot be created and ii) cannot be destroyed....the only thing that makes sense to me is something that "has always been".
Something similar to a circle, with no beginning and no end. Something that "always was, is, and shall be".
Another alternative view is that god/the creator (whatever you wan to call it)...Let's call it "Mr. Big ChrisBa" was something non physical that projected itself onto the world. So "Mr. Big ChrisBa" had the idea of a universe and projected that idea from the nonphysical to the physical, sort of like how you have an idea of a building which is something nonphysical and eventually it becomes something physical - the building.
But what is the "real" building - the idea or the building? If we destroy the building and don't have a blueprint of it, we can never reproduce it. But if he have an idea of that blueprint in our mind, no matter how many times that building gets wiped out, as long as we have the idea of the building close at had (the nonphysical thing), we can reproduce the physical thing.
This is similar to Socrates' theory of correspondence that everything in the physical world has it's origin in an idea.
Just some thoughts - can't claim I came up with them myself unfortunately
Not to nit pick but, the First Law of Thermodynamics says that energy under normal conditions cannot be created or destroyed, simply transformed from one type of energy to another. We create energy all the time with nuclear physics. I know nuclear reactions are not normal conditions, but it does happen all the time throughout the universe.
Why are you so emotionally attached and confrontational when it comes to disproving something you don't believe in?
Don't you hate those bible waving 700 Club types who want you to believe the world is only 5,000 years old and there's an old guy in the sky with wings flying around?
Your statement above sounds just as dogmatic as those types.
Can you challenge your mind to just for a second entertain the idea that just because something seems absolutely irrational, unintelligent and stupid/crazy to YOU - it's not necessarily irrational, unintelligent and stupid/crazy PERIOD?
Radical atheism and religious fundamentalism are two sides of the same coin.
I'm not personally attacking you mind you, I'm just asking you to be open minded. Of course open-mindedness might not be something you value and one would have to respect that too....
An open minded man:
"Einstein would later come close to these sentiments. But at the time, his leap away from faith was a radical one. "Through the reading of popular scientific books, I soon reached the conviction that much in the stories of the Bible could not be true. The consequence was a positively fanatic orgy of free thinking coupled with the impression that youth is intentionally being deceived by the state through lies; it was a crushing impression."
What separates me from most so-called atheists is a feeling of utter humility toward the unattainable secrets of the harmony of the cosmos. (Albert Einstein to Joseph Lewis, Apr. 18, 1953)
No one's questioning your right to believe that God is a fairytale. However, to conclude that that reality is the absolute reality comes dangerously close to mimicking the behavior the the religious fanatics who want everyone to believe in their interpretations of the bible.
The fact that you wanted to close this thread because you think that "God is a fairytale" was a little scary to me - especially since you have no need to concern with something that doesn't exist!
Let those that believe play their fairytale game
A lot of "what if's" there. The whole point with modern science is that "what ifs" are STUPID unless they can somehow be hypothesized or proven. EVEN IF a god exist, and jesus is his homeboy, it's still stupid and retarded to believe in one. Believing in the possibility, however, is fine.
Is it possible that we live in a computer generated world controlled by robots (like the matrix)? Yes, yes it is.
Is it stupid to believe that without a single shred of evidence? Yes...... yes it is.
I'd like to hear what you have to say if you don't mind. I'm going on a Wickedfire diet come Wednesday so let us have it
Again, I apologize for childishly calling you an "idiot" in another thread
@riddarhusetgal
I have proven your logic to be incorrect without resorting to faith.
Now you just argue the same points over and over. You are not even above cutting out the logic reasoning part of my reply.
Please, go back to my last post and dissect the logic, as that is what you wanted to do.
I am not going to discuss faith here, just logic.
Kthnxbye.
::emp::
PS: You are really starting to piss me off. "I just want to talk logic - preachpreachpissawaylogicpreachpreach"
I have proven your logic to be incorrect without resorting to faith.
Now you just argue the same points over and over. You are not even above cutting out the logic reasoning part of my reply.
Please, go back to my last post and dissect the logic, as that is what you wanted to do.
I am not going to discuss faith here, just logic.
Kthnxbye.
::emp::
PS: You are really starting to piss me off. "I just want to talk logic - preachpreachpissawaylogicpreachpreach"
I'm not sure, but when scientific facts can prove it then I'll start to recognize it
Bottom line is if people want to believe in whatever that's fine, if people don't want to believe in whatever that's fine as well.. just don't push your beliefs or lack there of onto other people..
there's nothing worse than a religious person trying to push their faith onto everyone else. I'm pretty sure to them that it's just as bad when someone who doesn't believe question their faith.
there's nothing worse than a religious person trying to push their faith onto everyone else. I'm pretty sure to them that it's just as bad when someone who doesn't believe question their faith.
The problem is that we all know self-delusion causes the problems in this world.
Could you possibly imagine scientists, using scientific methods to figure out things, would just all the sudden, one day stop their progress at some point and just say "You know what? Nevermind all this, I'm pretty sure God did this shit right here."
That's simply not science. Science isn't about giving up and attaching some general, easy explanation to an issue. That's way too simple and doesn't solve or, more importantly, improve anything. Why would a real scientist apply ID as a solution? Does he end there? Does he not explore the causes of this ID? How many other things will he start to apply ID to? When does it stop being science and starts becoming religion?
The problem with creating this mystical ID is that you end up giving it a personality, because after all, it is a conscious being with some sort of agenda right? So after this ID created us, is it done with us? Or is it still hovering right over us, perhaps judging our every actions? Oh shit! Does this ID control what happens to us after we die too?
^ Religion. This ID is a mystical creature, whose personality can only be imagined and assumed based on what traits we humans give it. You can't prove otherwise. You cannot prove that ID is NOT just imagined in the mind. Why? Because EVERY Scientific hypothesis starts in the mind. But ID doesn't solve anything, and often leads to self delusion.
I believe a real scientist is more likely to ultimately conclude that all matter is really energy and that energy is infinite. This would ingulf any ID you can imagine too, as God is an energy, and uses energy. Cause and effect.
turbolapp said:
lol don't worry, he doesn't believe in god (like that) either. He's just saying it's probably better to "feel an utter humility towards the unattainable secrets of the harmony of the cosmos," as stated in the Einstein quote he keeps posting (and I see why, everyone keeps missing it).
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A jesus toupee. With fangs.
Ok ok. So her hair was lumpy and it was too early in the morning to delete it(I wake up slow). So I blurred. sue me.
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