The root cause of 9/11 - why the west is hated.

[harrymouni]

LMFAO @ Jondoe0069
IRA is a case in point lots of news coverage about what they are up to.
Meanwhile not a peep about the various protestant terrorist organizations.

They're both as bad as each other and the idea that news orgs suppress protestant atrocites... what a load of left wing, conspiracy bullshit. First off, all prod terrorists have been on ceasefire since the early 90s except when they kill each other in drug gangland shootings but no-one minds that.

 

[nop_90]

They're both as bad as each other and the idea that news orgs suppress protestant atrocites... what a load of left wing, conspiracy bullshit. First off, all prod terrorists have been on ceasefire since the early 90s except when they kill each other in drug gangland shootings but no-one minds that.

I agree that they are both just as bad.

I was referring to "american media" maybe in europe both sides get equal coverage.
Also it could be that majority of americans do not know that there are prod terrorists, so american news media will not bother reporting it.

Any news media is biased. Every news outlet has a political/monetary motive.

If you have a jewish newspaper, probably publishing about jewish attrocities in the westbank probably will not make your readers/advertisers too happy. While if u are an arab newspaper probably good thing to write about. And vice versa .

 

[oziman]

One man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.

Ben-Gurion and the Hebrew Resistance Movement carried out terrorist attacks against the British, where do you place them on your moral compass?

One man's terrorist is another's terrorist.

Meaning, you have to accept that there is a good and evil in the world and that at some point you have a moral compass that guides you. So Hamas, Hizbullah, Jihad, Al-Queda which seek my destruction are evil.

The Hagana, The Irgun and the Lehi did what was needed to be done in order to form a state. They didn't embrace a culture of murder, didn't deliberately go after civilians, women and children and did not seek the wholesale slaughter of the British or Arabs. There is a difference.

 

[xmcp123]

I bet the thousands Americans that died and are buried in France just turned in their graves on this post. The U.S. WILL have to bail Europe out again..mark my word.

If its not from the up-comming rebuilt Soviet Union, it will be from the Islamist that are running crazy up and down the streets of Europe.

Europe will sing a different song then.

Wow. I told myself I would not get baited into this thread. Oops.
Why the hell would they turn in their graves? Is it that bad to enter a war for your own country's interests? It doesn't make them bad people. They're still heroes to their nation. But that doesn't change the fact that we really did not bail out Europe.
You are giving an emotional argument without refuting a single point that was said.
The US lost around 417,000 soldiers. And that is a terrible thing. But Russia lost 10.7 fucking million. 25 million soldiers were lost in World War 2.
Are we really so conceited to believe that our amount of soldiers(1.66% of the deaths) "bailed out" Europe?
And I will also point out a lot of that 1.66% was in Japan, not Europe.

I'm not trying to minimize the sacrifices of our soldiers. They were brave as hell, and served their country extraordinarily well. But it's fucking ridiculous that the US acts like Europe owes us their ass 60+ years later.

 

[oziman]

Wow. I told myself I would not get baited into this thread. Oops.
Why the hell would they turn in their graves? Is it that bad to enter a war for your own country's interests? It doesn't make them bad people. They're still heroes to their nation. But that doesn't change the fact that we really did not bail out Europe.
You are giving an emotional argument without refuting a single point that was said.
The US lost around 417,000 soldiers. And that is a terrible thing. But Russia lost 10.7 fucking million. 25 million soldiers were lost in World War 2.
Are we really so conceited to believe that our amount of soldiers(1.66% of the deaths) "bailed out" Europe?
And I will also point out a lot of that 1.66% was in Japan, not Europe.

I'm not trying to minimize the sacrifices of our soldiers. They were brave as hell, and served their country extraordinarily well. But it's fucking ridiculous that the US acts like Europe owes us their ass 60+ years later.

Yah, well this thread must have touched a nerve b/c I've been spending way too much time on WF lately.

The US bailed out Europe - forget about soldiers.. Ever heard of Lend Lease? When the US entered WW2, it made a difference.

No question the Russians suffered a lot of losses - my question is, how many of those were internal to the NKVD/KGB and Stalin's murderous binges? I don't trust any statistics coming from Russia pretty much from the last two centuries up to now.

Oh, and who else fought the war in the pacific? Next you're gonna tell me that the Australians and the Filiponos won that theater.

I think people should realize in nation building and politics there is no real quid pro quo - we saved the world and no one gives a rats ass. The Germans murdered millions of Jews and now there one of Israel's biggest allies.. C'est la vie.

 

[LazyHippy]

One man's terrorist is another's terrorist.

Meaning, you have to accept that there is a good and evil in the world and that at some point you have a moral compass that guides you. So Hamas, Hizbullah, Jihad, Al-Queda which seek my destruction are evil.

The Hagana, The Irgun and the Lehi did what was needed to be done in order to form a state. They didn't embrace a culture of murder, didn't deliberately go after civilians, women and children and did not seek the wholesale slaughter of the British or Arabs. There is a difference.

Your last paragraph contradicts your first - you see them as freedom fighter's, others certainly saw them as terrorists.

Those groups don't seek your destruction, they seek the destruction of the Jewish State of Israel and I agree to some extent - religion and politics should be separate, especially in a modern, wealthy country.

Do you really think if they had the same weaponry as Israel they would choose to send kids to blow themselves up on buses? Take away the religion crap (suicide bombers etc) and the actions are typical of any resistance movement fighting a much more powerful regime.

 

[oziman]

Your last paragraph contradicts your first - you see them as freedom fighter's, others certainly saw them as terrorists.

To quote David Ben Gurion in his pre-state years: "We will fight the British as if there were no Germans, and we will fight the Germans as if there were no British". Were bombs detonated against civillian targets? Yes (King David Hotel, for example) but each time authorities were warned well in advance - no one was looking to deliberately hurt civillians.

Those groups don't seek your destruction, they seek the destruction of the Jewish State of Israel and I agree to some extent - religion and politics should be separate, especially in a modern, wealthy country.

My friend, take any derogatory/inflammatory statement with the words Zionist, Israel, Israeli and swipe it out to Jewish, Jew, Jew - it's all the same thing. The same reason these people target civillian JEWISH establishments outside the state of Israel.

Do you really think if they had the same weaponry as Israel they would choose to send kids to blow themselves up on buses? Take away the religion crap (suicide bombers etc) and the actions are typical of any resistance movement fighting a much more powerful regime.

See Second Lebanese War, 2006.

You keep saying: religion crap. Most of the world, and especially this part of the world believes. I don't think religion is the root of all evil. I think man is the root of all evil.

 

[LazyHippy]

No, it's not the same thing. Just as most Muslims don't support Al Quaida there are many Jews who don't support Israel's actions.

You call the invasion of Lebanon a war? Must have been one of the most one-sided wars in recent history. Hezbollah et al certainly don't have the same level of equipment Israel has (fortunately really, as otherwise the casualties would have been a lot higher and certainly more balanced).

The IRA used to give warnings but they were still seen by most as terrorists. If the Jewish resistance had had to fight for 50 years, living in third world conditions, don't you think the extremists might have been successful in gaining support for more hard-line actions?

 

[LazyHippy]

I don't think religion is the root of all evil. I think man is the root of all evil.

I agree with ya on that one.

 

[nop_90]

USA sure liked Osama bin Laden when they where funding him to do terrorist activities in the moslem parts of the former soviet union. One of the reasons the soviet union occupied afganistan was because guys like Osama (who where funded by USA) where using afgan as a staging point to go into russia and do terrorism.

USA has a history of funding terrorists, even as early as 1812 when they where funding fenians to do raids into canada etc.

Don't cry about terrorist acts against you when you are meanwhile funding terrorists yourselves.

 

[popeye]

USA sure liked Osama bin Laden when they where funding him to do terrorist activities in the moslem parts of the former soviet union. One of the reasons the soviet union occupied afganistan was because guys like Osama (who where funded by USA) where using afgan as a staging point to go into russia and do terrorism.

USA has a history of funding terrorists, even as early as 1812 when they where funding fenians to do raids into canada etc.

Don't cry about terrorist acts against you when you are meanwhile funding terrorists yourselves.

The enemy of your enemy is your friend.

 

[LazyHippy]

The enemy of your enemy is your friend.

Hence why this shit is happening...

I think John Stewart nails it in this piece: Viddler.com - John Stewart - America To The Rescue - Uploaded by axiz

 

[HarveyJ]

The enemy of your enemy is your friend.

No, the enemy of your enemy is the guy who's going to shoot you in the back the moment you turn around from your enemy's corpse...

 

[shitzu]

I am sooo tired of the old "we saved Europe from Hitler" spiel you get from the American dipshits all the time.

So stop listening.

1. Hitler was NOT winning. The German war machine was grinding to a halt. His troops were getting ground up on his "I will attack every front at once" tactics already. Yes, it might have taken more time, but eh..

Germany was winning the war. They were occupying countries at a record pace, and outgunning the only real force in Europe (Britian). No single country could have defeated the Nazi's. It took the combined force of the world to make it happen. America was the tipping point. Hitler knew this. That is why he allied with Japan. He was hoping to weaken us with a 2 front war. He knew if the entire US military force was used against him he'd lose, and lose miserably. He was betting that we could not fight a 2 front war effectively.

2. The US did not enter this war willingly nor as the shining hero. As a fact, the US stayed out of the war (and wanted to stay out of it) until a stupid German blew up a US passenger ship. The public outcry made the US enter the war.

No we tried to keep our nose out of WW2 despite the constant pleas from European countries. It wasn't our business. Also you have your facts screwed up. The sinking of the Lusitania was the precursor to WW I. The bombing of Pearl Harbor and the constant requests from Allies in Europe is what drug is into WW II.

3. It was fucking 70 years ago. Get over it already. You might have been heroes in shiny armor once (or not, see 1 and 2) but that was a looong time ago.
In between then and now we have the Cuba crisis, Vietnam, Iraq war 1, Guantanoma and the second Iraq war. Your shiny armor is getting spots all over.

It was ONLY 70 years ago. People nowadays seem to think their so advanced over 70 years ago. NOTHING HAS CHANGED! We're still the same evil, power hungry, retarded creatures we were 70 years ago. We're still driven by irrational emotions and our inherent nature. We just have better technology and a more effective means of killing large amounts of people. America has made mistakes, but this is the first time in history where a countries war time practices have been scrutinized to the extent it is now.

4. Things today are not as clear-cut as they have been. In fact, WWII might have been the last black and white, good and evil war ever fought.

Quite possibly. It's impossible to fight America & its Allies in traditional war. Terrorism/Guerrilla warfare is really the only way to effectively fight America. We're doing what we feel is right and justified just as they are doing what they feel is right and justified. The Iraq war should not blamed on the American people. We were lied to, duped, tricked, just like the rest of the world. Bush is the real enemy, not America.

 

[Lapris]

The sinking of the Lusitania was the precursor to WW I. The bombing of Pearl Harbor and the constant requests from Allies in Europe is what drug is into WW II.

Should we start on the 'false flag' angle now? Oh, please!!



:R:

 

[yoey]

The enemy of your enemy is your friend.

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Meet the reason why were in the situation we are in.

What is with fucking conservatives that enable them to never learn from history?

The enemy of our enemy was Bin laden at one time. And looked what happened with that.

Nice logic there popeye.

 

[harrymouni]

the fact of the matter is islam is a crazy religion, the imans have everyone brainwashed that the west (led by the usa) is corrupt and evil. why do the pc fairies defend this religion of hate, where women are treated like shit and they have the most backward beliefs (even more so that catholicism)

it *is* an old fashion battle between good and evil.

and the main battleground is not iraq, it's rotterdam, stockholm, oslo and birmingham and other areas of europe where the politicians are bending over to muslim demands, where muslims are forming ghettos, don't integrate with locals, a lot 2nd generation don't speak the native language, 'immoral' white women are being gang raped by muslim youths.

you don't see this happening in the states, everyone knows the fucking rules and there's little PC bullshit. Europeans used to think America was a racist country but that was when we were 100% christian white. How attitudes have changed over here