Congratulations USA

Fatbat said:
Dangers of Fracking nice little website.
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It's a beautiful site, really like the navigation.... But I do wish they offered other solutions at the bottom other than "Contact your local officials." -That'll just lead to guv regulation.

I was just thinking about ways this could be fought without the government and under crony capitalism... I don't see a single way to do so prior to mass lawsuits by the families of the deceased victims... The "Protection" uncle sam offers citizens is something they hold a monopoly over here, so if they choose to look the other way and give big Oil the advantage in such a dispute, there IS NO way to protect yourself.

Meanwhile, if we had a Voluntaryist society, property rights could be easily structured to not allow fracking to happen underneath your land or in a way that taints your water supply... And immediate court cases could and would ensue if they did.

Good luck trying that here, statists.
 


Fracking is horrible for the environment.

Given that most of the land used for fracking is obtained via government, whining about it "not standing" is perfectly acceptable - there would be a lot less places to frack (shit up - couldn't help it) without a government exerting control over land it has no legitimate claim to.
 
I think it's also insideous that they can frack UNDER your land, because they don't just send a drill straight down, it curves to find the deposit.

So one day you as a homeowner could be sitting there and have flames come out of your faucet or be at the very epicenter of a little earthquake, making your property a disaster zone and instantly worthless... All from a wellhead miles and miles away from you, which didn't ask you if it was kosher if it could drill underneath your home.
 
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lukep said:
I guess I could have worded that a bit more carefully... But nothing I said noted a preference for solving the problem through government force.

The use of "it certainly should not stand" was in reference to people not allowing it via the slightly-free market. I know I wouldn't buy gas from a company who who is a known Fracker. THEN, after the customer resistance to companies who frack, there is the affected property owners and all of their lawsuits against these companies... THEY will not let this stand, of course the government will be all to happy to look the other way.

So to clarify my sloppy 4am post, This cannot stand because:

A. Customers will resist companies that sell fracked fuel.
B. Constant lawsuits from distressed property owners will make the companies who offer fracked fuel too expensive.​

I repeat, this cannot stand.
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Sort of like how people refuse to eat non-organic food?
 
lukep said:
I think it's also insideous that they can frack UNDER your land, because they don't just send a drill straight down, it curves to find the deposit.

So one day you as a homeowner could be sitting there and have flames come out of your faucet or be at the very epicenter of a little earthquake, making your property a disaster zone and instantly worthless... All from a wellhead miles and miles away from you, which didn't ask you if it was kosher if it could drill underneath your home.
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They can't legally frack under your ground if you own the ground. You are required to give them permission to do so.

In my area, they are paying $1,000 per acre for the right to frack.
 
I'll fracking frack whatever the frack I want to frack.

Hmm, spend billions on wars without end in a region with a two thousand plus year history of inhospitality or generate billions of dollars worth of high quality energy resources here at home where the biggest problem* is they can't build the fracking pipeline to Texas quick enough. Tough choice there...

*ok, ok, there exists a small chance the Rockies will collapse into rubble from all the subterranean holes but really, it's not like we really need them. They shelter a whole lot of Mormons and they block my view of really killer sunrises, I'm still calling this scenario a win.
 
charlesmartel said:
Are the Canadians polluting their groundwater?
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Canada is mostly wasteland. I'm not for sure, but since the entire population of Canada is squashed upon their southern border I'd bet the fracking isn't usually where the ppl are.


schockergd said:
Sort of like how people refuse to eat non-organic food?
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non-organic food doesn't shoot flames out of your kitchen faucet or cause actual earthquakes.


schockergd said:
They can't legally frack under your ground if you own the ground. You are required to give them permission to do so.

In my area, they are paying $1,000 per acre for the right to frack.
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This I didn't know. Thanks. I wonder what the penalty is though when they've been caught fracking under someone's house who didn't agree?


schockergd said:
I'm curious, how many of you guys are driving electric cars right now?
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WTF does that have to do with the price of lice on uranus? You think I'm some greenpeace hippy? I just don't think americans will sit still for all that flamewater, bro!


Grindstone said:
Hmm, spend billions on wars without end in a region with a two thousand plus year history of inhospitality or generate billions of dollars worth of high quality energy resources here at home where the biggest problem* is they can't build the fracking pipeline to Texas quick enough. Tough choice there...
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I'm all for more energy independence, I'm just saying the more stories like kitchens burning down and earthquake frequency ramping up hit the news, the more victims will use the government against fracking in general. It will surely be a political hotbutton before long.

Now that the Petrodollar is on its' last leg, I can't see how the US can afford NOT to frack though, so I'm just happy I'll be in Thailand by the time you guys figure it all out.
 
lukep said:
Canada is mostly wasteland. I'm not for sure, but since the entire population of Canada is squashed upon their southern border I'd bet the fracking isn't usually where the ppl are.
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No. Most of Canada is sparsely populated specifically because most of Canada is still pristine wilderness - and because it's fucking cold.

Canadians, much to their luck, never underwent the same breakneck expansion as the US.
 
SkyFire said:
No. Most of Canada is sparsely populated specifically because most of Canada is still pristine wilderness - and because it's fucking cold.

Canadians, much to their luck, never underwent the same breakneck expansion as the US.
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Actually, you're closer than Luke, but still not correct.

Most of Canada is owned by the Crown. The Queen is still our ruler, through her proxy who serves with our government.

While Canada is a parliamentary democracy, the vast majority of land in Canada is owned by the Royal family.

The areas that have been allowed to own and develop are only a small portion of the greater landmass. The Crown will allow mineral exploration and resource harvesting in some areas, but it's not as straightforward as a conventional land purchase.
 
Seriously, most of Canada is mother natures most stock. If there is a place left on Earth that could harbor a new colony, it'd be in Nu. It'd be ass cold, but it's be Nu.

guerilla said:
Actually, you're closer than Luke, but still not correct.

Most of Canada is owned by the Crown. The Queen is still our ruler, through her proxy who serves with our government.

While we're a parliamentary democracy, Canada is owned by the Royal Family, and until recently, many of our key services were Crown Corporations.

The areas we have been allowed to own and develop are only a small portion of the greater landmass. The Crown will allow mineral exploration and resource harvesting in some areas, but it's not as straightforward as a conventional land purchase.
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I wasn't referring to ownership, only how much of the land has been developed, which is less rather than more, ya? Aren't there like 20k people in Nu?

I'll be honest, I know pretty much nothing about the Canadian system of government.
 
Kiopa_Matt said:
Yes, what a wasteland...Or would you like to get into the fuckton of natural resources Canada has?
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SkyFire said:
No. Most of Canada is sparsely populated specifically because most of Canada is still pristine wilderness - and because it's fucking cold.

Canadians, much to their luck, never underwent the same breakneck expansion as the US.
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guerilla said:
Actually, you're closer than Luke, but still not correct.

Most of Canada is owned by the Crown. The Queen is still our ruler, through her proxy who serves with our government.
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Would you three like to get a room?

The question was about whether or not there was fracking going on directly underneath the feet of Canadian residents. My suggestion was that there is plenty room northwards that it doesn't have to be done under your very feet.

If you're going to refute me, please stay on subject. There's simply no point in talking about the beauty of the canadian wilderness or its' political ownership in a thread about fracking in the usa!
 
SkyFire said:
I wasn't referring to ownership, only how much of the land has been developed, which is less rather than more, ya?
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Right, but it's not because it is cold or a wasteland, or because there is some love of nature.

It's a fact of ownership.

People would be surprised to know how much of the earth the British Royal family holds title to.
 
lukep said:
The question was about whether or not there was fracking going on directly underneath the feet of Canadian residents.
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There is.

Fracking is just the latest thing for luddites and idiots to get worked up over.
 
guerilla said:
Right, but it's not because it is cold or a wasteland, or because there is some love of nature.

It's a fact of ownership.

People would be surprised to know how much of the earth the British Royal family holds title to.
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Oh hell, don't make me argue both you and lukep!

It's not a wasteland (lukep), it is mostly undeveloped and as a -result- it's still pretty pristine (the rest of you), reason why doesn't really matter to the argument against it being wasteland. That's all, fuck me, I'm going back to my hole.
 
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