Can a nation be free without open borders?

dmnEPC

dmnEPC

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Dec 23, 2010
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If you can't come and go as you please, are you really free? Clearly closing the boarders doesn't do shit to prevent crime (drugs, illegals ),so why not open them? What would really be so bad if people could come and go as they please? Might an open border policy spur on the economy?


Edit. Open=no checkpoints
 


HEY SOMEONE MUST HAVE TOLD YOU WE DONT HAVE ENOUGH SHITTY THREADS.

THANKS FOR HELPING OUT BRO.
 
My opinion is that there is no absolute concept of "freedom" that if people reach, they'll stop complaining from that point.

If they get a certain amount of freedom, after x amount of time, they'll take that much freedom as granted and start asking for more.

You promise everyone 50 bucks an hour of wages for even the most brain-dead kind of work, yet they'll take that much for granted after some time.

There is no amount of freedom that'll make them stop complaining completely. Personally I would focus more on things such as how much financial, general living, belief freedoms my country has in comparison with another country.

An easy way to judge is to judge relatively. Everyone has balls which hurt when kicked but no one (or 0.00001%) complains of having balls at an easy to kick location. That is because everyone has balls. When someone else has something but you don't, it gets easy to complain.
 
dmnEPC said:
If you can't come and go as you please, are you really free? Clearly closing the boarders doesn't do shit to prevent crime (drugs, illegals ),so why not open them? What would really be so bad if people could come and go as they please? Might an open border policy spur on the economy?


Edit. Open=no checkpoints
Click to expand...

They can't have an open border policy for "everyone"

At certain places, it already happened. Think EU

For much of the world, you can already travel to most places without any visa refusals. As a resident of a country such as Chile, one can travel to Europe or America without a problem. I know you can't work without a permit.

Europe and America can't allow this kind of freedom to a region such as South East Asia which is full of people. There are like 2 billion people over there. No one would want to risk them coming over to the first world. It is very understandable. You got to see the situation the way it is without any bias.

Just my 2 cents
 
Promising someone to earn 50 an hour for braindead work isn't freedom. It's dependence. Slavery. That's why they bitch. People know they're owned entirely. Bitch is all they can do. Like anyone but themselves cares when they hold nonsensical signs up at wall street.
 
wayn3 said:
Promising someone to earn 50 an hour for braindead work isn't freedom. It's dependence. Slavery. That's why they bitch. People know they're owned entirely. Bitch is all they can do. Like anyone but themselves cares when they hold nonsensical signs up at wall street.
Click to expand...

You live in Germany amirite? Have you ever talked to a bunch of people who live on one buck a day without any assistance whatsoever?

OK, maybe my example was not suitable, but the point remains. People will always take shit for granted and want moarrr
 
jacky8 said:
They can't have an open border policy for "everyone"

At certain places, it already happened. Think EU

For much of the world, you can already travel to most places without any visa refusals. As a resident of a country such as Chile, one can travel to Europe or America without a problem. I know you can't work without a permit.

Europe and America can't allow this kind of freedom to a region such as South East Asia which is full of people. There are like 2 billion people over there. No one would want to risk them coming over to the first world. It is very understandable. You got to see the situation the way it is without any bias.

Just my 2 cents
Click to expand...

Do you think all 2 billion would come? How would they even get there? I can't see a good reason to keep them out if they want to come. There a millions of acres of unoccupied space if that's your conceren. What would the legitimate reasons for not allowing it? Jobs? Lol
 
dmnEPC said:
Do you think all 2 billion would come? How would they even get there? I can't see a good reason to keep them out if they want to come. There a millions of acres of unoccupied space if that's your conceren. What would the legitimate reasons for not allowing it? Jobs? Lol
Click to expand...

I could bet tens of millions would come in the first 2 weeks alone lol

Maybe you wouldn't mind them coming, but if you ask people around you, they'll mind. The vast majority wouldn't be okay with it.

if that's your conceren
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I'm in SE Asia. Its not really my concern if half the people here move to the americas or europe.
 
jacky8 said:
You live in Germany amirite? Have you ever talked to a bunch of people who live on one buck a day without any assistance whatsoever?

OK, maybe my example was not suitable, but the point remains. People will always take shit for granted and want moarrr
Click to expand...

Yea. I've lived with them. They're nice people. More Free than the government funded diabetes crowd will ever be.

Your example is not the problem. The problem is that you don't know what freedom is. Money doesn't grant it. That's the delusional freedom from idiocy that people like thehobbster believe in.
 
wayn3 said:
Yea. I've lived with them. They're nice people. More Free than the government funded diabetes crowd will ever be.

Your example is not the problem. The problem is that you don't know what freedom is. Money doesn't grant it. That's the delusional freedom from idiocy that people like thehobbster believe in.
Click to expand...

Don't interpret my perception of freedom from just one example I chose to put forward :p

I'd doubt anyone who claims to know the absolute truth about ANYTHING. It shows ego, and ego is stupidity. Instead of claiming to know the truth, you could choose to seek the truth.
 
wayn3 said:
Yea. I've lived with them. They're nice people. More Free than the government funded diabetes crowd will ever be.

Your example is not the problem. The problem is that you don't know what freedom is. Money doesn't grant it. That's the delusional freedom from idiocy that people like thehobbster believe in.
Click to expand...

Another example is someone living in Estonia taking all the environmental goodness for granted. Only if he would compare that to a desert with no sign of life..

While there's nothing wrong with looking to improve the setup you live in, shitting all over it altogether and claiming it is one hundred percent crap is also not cool. Better be grateful for and preserve what good you got, and seek to improve upon it.
 
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Seeking the truth while pretentiously acknowledging that you'll never be able to find it sounds like some awful neckbeard sysiphos crossover.

Don't tell me to appreciate the perks my government tries to grant me. They're bureaucrats who administrate worthless life. Merchants of death. It's true. Life is better than it was in the past. Any kind of past. But they're not the reason. The awesome in the world happens because people work hard to make awesome happen. Not because some pretend benevolent overlord grants them some reality transcending freedom they couldn't have achieved on their own.

Their lunacy is self consistent. They do obviously have to restrict free travel but only because they claimed they'd help everyone in need in the first place. They need to raise taxes to care for the homeless they made homeless. They need money to arbitrate the strike cases they made possible. I don't care about any of this. Don't tell me i should. The instant some tragedy happens to some imaginary currency market, all that shit is gone. I'm busy doing things that matter. Whatever that might be. If anything, government is a necessary evil.
 
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