Congratulations USA

lukep said:
Would you three like to get a room?
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When you call Canada a wasteland, how can anyone take anything else you say seriously?

What I probably love the most about LukeP is his huge mancrush on guerilla. Guerilla tried to let LukeP down easy, but Luke's not having any of that! Luke figures that maybe if he shakes his feathered can in just the right way, that perhaps he can win Guerilla's heart!
 


I do not know much on the subject but isn't fracking expensive?

So when oil prices drop again it all stop - no? The US only steps up production when prices are this high.

I was researching a development deal in Dickinson ND and read articles about the last boom - it all dried up overnight. It'll happen again. The US will stop when prices drop and go back to dependence.

Unless fracking gets cheaper. Let me know if I am wrong about the cost. Otherwise this will all pass.
 
guerilla said:
Appeals to history are logical fallacies.

Learn economics. Then you'll understand the probable outcomes.
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Oh. I thought we were naming college courses.

I simply pointed out that when prices drop expensive methods will be dropped. Then I asked if fracking was expensive because I recall that being said before. There was a boom before that left many towns like ghost towns practically overnight. For example, when I was paying $0.72 gallon in the 80's - previous boomtowns were abandoned.
 
REIMktg said:
I simply pointed out that when prices drop expensive methods will be dropped.
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That presumes that one number fluctuates and the other does not. It's a simple model, but it doesn't reflect reality.

Fracking isn't cheap,the more it is done, the cheaper it will get.

It cost millions to sequence a human genome 10 years ago and we should be able to sequence them for under $1,000 by the end of this year.
 
Wow, I formally apologize for using the word Wasteland then. I guess I thought it could be used interchangeably with 'uninhabited.' My bad.

Back on topic: I have no clue who the seirra organization is, I got my info from more than just the gasland movie... Mainstream media, sadly, is where I remember the stories about groundwater pollution and earthquakes tied to fracking.

As for it being just another hyped-up issue for luddites, use some common sense here for a minute:

These energy companies don't disclose many of the toxins they are pumping huge amounts of into the earth. That's a fact. Each company has their own recipe for fracking fluid, and they don't disclose the whole recipe because it's labeled as a trade secret... And then 30-80% of that mystery mix stays underground at each site!

Even if you don't believe the flames-from-the-tap documentaries and aren't scared of the earthquakes already reported in the news, Surely you can't think that it's a stellar idea to have millions of deep holes drilled into the earth under our very feet, pressurized, and filled up with toxins that these energy companies won't disclose.

Ever heard of Aquafers? Most people drink that that stuff one way or the other... And some of them are kinda big, like this one:

300px-Ogallala_saturated_thickness_1997-sattk97-v2.svg.png


So yeah, pumping billions of tons of secret toxins down there every year is perfectly fine here people... Nothing to see here...
 
lukep said:
Back on topic: I have no clue who the sierra organization is,
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Wow. I thought you were from CA. Never heard of Hetch Hetchy controversy?

Today, the Sierra Club has over 1.3 million members and supporters and is the oldest, largest, and most influential grassroots environmental organization in the United States.
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REIMktg said:
Wow. I thought you were from CA. Never heard of Hetch Hetchy controversy?
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Guess I wasn't in SoCal long enough... Spent most of my life in the south but a year there and then here in Kansas for the last 5 years.

I'll go google Hetchy when I get a moment, sounds like it'll be good for a laugh.
 
lukep said:
Canada is mostly wasteland. I'm not for sure, but since the entire population of Canada is squashed upon their southern border I'd bet the fracking isn't usually where the ppl are.



non-organic food doesn't shoot flames out of your kitchen faucet or cause actual earthquakes.



This I didn't know. Thanks. I wonder what the penalty is though when they've been caught fracking under someone's house who didn't agree?



WTF does that have to do with the price of lice on uranus? You think I'm some greenpeace hippy? I just don't think americans will sit still for all that flamewater, bro!



I'm all for more energy independence, I'm just saying the more stories like kitchens burning down and earthquake frequency ramping up hit the news, the more victims will use the government against fracking in general. It will surely be a political hotbutton before long.

Now that the Petrodollar is on its' last leg, I can't see how the US can afford NOT to frack though, so I'm just happy I'll be in Thailand by the time you guys figure it all out.
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#1 - But GMO/Non organic food kills people on a wholesale level and gives people cancer & tumors, right?

The reality is that the 'proof' provided by anti-fracking groups is severely lacking in any sort of peer-reviewed study. Someone went looking for a problem, came up with a little bit of evidence and then relied on a bunch of people who don't research to continue preaching it. As for "Flames from faucets" - The people who are saying this are currently being sued by several groups for outright fraud. In these cases, people hooked up propane/NG tanks to their water supply so that it would catch the water on fire. This has been proven by multiple sources.

I would also like to add - Fracking speeds up the process of which natural gas & oil move to the surface. Oil/methane contamination is a natrual process. So natural that a well at my house while growing up became contaminated with crude oil & natural gas. This was long before ANYONE talked about fracking. In my case, it was a natural process that just happened to us at the wrong place & the right time. If a well becomes contaminated due to leakage, it would have happened, or was happening already.

#2 - The penalty for fracking without permission is pretty severe. These types of laws have existed nearly since the foundation of the country. There is plenty of law about the process. In my area, the fine is about $10,000 per acre. Most of the land in my area that's being fracked are 200-500 acre fields at a time. Just ONE occurance of fracking someone else's property will result in the bankruptcy of a fracking outfit. On top of this, you have many fracking companies competing against eachother. They actively watch out & monitor other fracking operations for fraud like this since a occurrence would shut down another operation, and possibly lower the cost per acre to frack.
 
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