Russian Army Invades Ukraine And Seizes Crimea

potentialeight said:
I'm not trying to sound like a dick here, but can someone explain to me in 100 words or less why I should care about the Russia/Ukraine situation (whatever the hell that situation happens to be)?
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Because this and a lot of peoples' reactions seem to both bear striking similarities to Hitler's invasion of the Rhineland, as well as the Anschluss with Austria and if Russia enters into war, there's a possibility (if Russia want to stand a chance of winning) of China teaming up with them and us having no more mass produced merchandise. Oh, and death and destruction, etc.

66 words.
 


-joe- said:
there's a possibility (if Russia want to stand a chance of winning) of China teaming up with them and us having no more mass produced merchandise. Oh, and death and destruction, etc.
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China is not going to team up with Russia.
 
The only real worry I see here is what will Putin do if cornered against a wall...Namely, will he take the world down with him? Otherwise he's fucked either way. But we are talking about a man who arguably has the capability of destroying the world. That's not tin foil, that's fact.

In other words, if he goes completely fucking batshit crazy. Hitler put a bullet in his head, who knows if he would've pushed a button if it would've been there.
 
babylonian said:
Its funny how the same people that cry and bash US gov for using all their tax dollars for pimping up the army unnecessarily and spending billions on military might, are being proud and all in favor of this spending, which they previously opposed, when power and country's glory has to be proven and discussed.

They even use the same figures and charts to prove opposing points.
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I don't know if you're talking about me or what. But I didn't post that because I was 'proud'. Bit of a leap there. I posted it because I felt it disproved Itch's point. I'd rather that be a fraction of what it is.

Also I guess now posting a graph of our military spending = being in favor of inflation, bail outs, and all the other things Itch ranted about in his reply to me. All of that shit is bad, but it doesn't really help prove your original point.
 
Reive said:
I guess now posting a graph of our military spending = being in favor of inflation and all the other things Itch ranted about in his reply to me.
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I wouldn't worry about it. Reading comprehension can be challenging.
 
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Just kidding around, I have full confidence in our glorious leader.
 
Kiopa_Matt said:
Not really, but I'm not going to throw my arms in the air and start yelling "da Russians are evil!" either. At least not yet. See, there's a difference.

For example, the US put Iraq back into the stone age via their "shock & awe" campaign, then showed up on the border with over 100,000 soldiers. Now that's a straight-up invasion.

On the other hand, so far Russia has sent ~15,000 troops into a bordering region where the majority of current residents are Russian, and where other Russian interests are, after months of civil unrest in Ukraine. Plus not a shot has been reportedly fired yet. They're protecting their own interests and people, and that should be expected.

Now if we start seeing Russian tanks rolling through the streets of Kiev, then ok, that's a problem. So far though, there's absolutely no indication Russia plans on doing that. Maybe I'm wrong, but so far all I see is the Western media completely blowing this out of proportion.
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If the Mexican Army decided to roll into California or Texas to "protect" it's own people it would be a big problem. I don't get why it's different in the Ukraine.
 
SHGDigitalMedia said:
If the Mexican Army decided to roll into California or Texas to "protect" it's own people it would be a big problem. I don't get why it's different in the Ukraine.
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Are 58% of the people in Texas Mexican? Has Texas been destabalized to the point where security of things like naval ports are a concern due to mass protests and riots? No.

Besides, don't worry about trying to make sense of the world, because us peasants don't have access to anywhere near enough knowledge to make an educated decision. Most of the Western world thought going in to "shock & awe" Iraq was a great idea, but are all pissy because Russia is defending Crimea. One of those things that leaves me scratching my head, and lets me know there's alot more going on than I know about.
 
Kiopa_Matt said:
Are 58% of the people in Texas Mexican?
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According to the 2010 census 37.6% are. Give it a few more years.

Kiopa_Matt said:
defending Crimea
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Defended, annexing... who can tell the difference these days, eh?

Putin is a smart guy. He gave this stunt a lot of thought. It plays out well for him either way. If Russia annexes Crimea, he wins with his nationalist core back home. If he withdraws in a few days or weeks, he still scores points with his base for "protecting" ethic Russians and Russian interests.

The only way Putin loses this is if Obama decided to fire off a bunch of cruise missiles and reduce to ashes the bulk of Russia's naval fleet and bases in the region. Some sort of punitive strike. But of course, Putin is wagering that Obama doesn't have the balls for a move like that, since it could provoke a larger war.
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't the 1994(?) declaration basically establish Ukraine as a buffer state between Europe and Russia? It would seem that way.

It would make sense for both the EU and Russia to keep things that way and I don't understand why Ukraine couldn't just do business with both. Pushing for EU membership, which only half at most wanted would rightfully be seen as a change to the status quo by Russia.
 
rusvik said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't the 1994(?) declaration basically establish Ukraine as a buffer state between Europe and Russia? It would seem that way.

It would make sense for both the EU and Russia to keep things that way and I don't understand why Ukraine couldn't just do business with both. Pushing for EU membership, which only half at most wanted would rightfully be seen as a change to the status quo by Russia.
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They are pushing for EU membership because they want to be prosperous.

In 1994, Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia opted to start accession talks with the EU (and joined in 2002). Ukraine decided to stay in the Russian orbit.

In 1994 the GDP per head on a PPP basis was just $5000 in Latvia, lithuania and Estonia - like some of the poorer African nations.

Now it's like this:

Poland: $20,562
Lithuania: $21,383
Estonia: $21,714
Latvia: $18,058
Russia: $17,581
Ukraine: $7,295

Can you see why the Ukranians think they made the wrong bet? Botswana has nearly double the PPP GDP per Capita at $16060.

As for all this business about "there are Russians in Crimea". Well until Stalin invaded Western Ukraine, those regions belonged to Poland, Romania and Czechoslovakia.

See

Administrative divisions of Ukraine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The former Polish Oblasts (or provinces) were Lviv, Ivano Frankivsk, Ternopil, Volhynia and Rivne.

Transcarpathia was actually Czechoslovak till 1938 then Hungarian during the War.

Cernivtsi and the southern part of Odessa Oblast were Romanian 1919-1940 and again 1941-44.

They belong with their brothers in the EU
 
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