Lethal injection goes wrong... Time to ditch the death penalty?

The death penalty as well as a belief in God often creates a hypocrisy in those that stand against it.

Many people suddenly believe in the death penalty when a family member is brutally murdered.

Many people suddenly believe in God while on their death bed.

I guess it's just human nature.
 


xmcp123 said:
So let me get this straight.
You have next to no faith in the government, except when it comes to deciding who to kill?
Make up your mind foo.
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i will never, ever, ever, understand this about conservatives.
 
popeye said:
The death penalty as well as a belief in God often creates a hypocrisy in those that stand against it.

Many people suddenly believe in the death penalty when a family member is brutally murdered.

Many people suddenly believe in God while on their death bed.

I guess it's just human nature.
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+rep
 
Mill said:
I could care how painful the people being put to death is, the fact is they comitted a crime, took someones life. They deserve the same fate. If someone Rapes and Kills someone I say strap them to a bed let the lifers in prison rape the guy , then have them all shank the fucker to death.
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[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkFW27sPLL0]YouTube - Superjail randomness[/ame]
 
popeye said:
The death penalty as well as a belief in God often creates a hypocrisy in those that stand against it.

Many people suddenly believe in the death penalty when a family member is brutally murdered.

Many people suddenly believe in God while on their death bed.

I guess it's just human nature.
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Holyshit! I agree with popeye! I'm pro-death penalty.

I don't actually like the lethal injection. I think they should bring back this:

guillotine.gif



I don't know anything that is that quick, efficient and cheap.
 
conv3rsion said:
i will never, ever, ever, understand this about conservatives.
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Actually that's two different things that I will never understand about conservatives. 1) exactly what shady said. 2) That only their god can decide who lives or dies except when humans want to make exceptions to this to please their own desire for blood lust...and then they get to decide.

And to quote shady, make up your mind foo.
 
popeye said:
The death penalty as well as a belief in God often creates a hypocrisy in those that stand against it.

Many people suddenly believe in the death penalty when a family member is brutally murdered.

Many people suddenly believe in God while on their death bed.

I guess it's just human nature.
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Fucking hell, intelligent comment from Popeye with no cheap insults or attempts at political point-scoring! I'm amazed! (Although, I still disagree - I think it's more sociological than natural - nurture, not nature.)
 
hellblazer said:
you're totally confused. my original post was how the OP made a HUGE leap in logic:

botched execution = death penalty bad

xmcp thought i was saying something about the efficacy of the government, so i played along. but here's the truth:

we need the death penalty. nothing stops a would-be murderer more than knowing they will pay the ultimate price for their evil. it's an incredibly effective deterrent.

but the people that piss and moan about the wrong people getting convicted/executed don't really have a problem with the death penalty - they have a problem with the conviction process.

so fix the conviction process. the death penalty issue is a moral decision everyone has to make for themselves. if enough americans want it, eventually it'll make its way through the courts.

but my original point is that the OP is pulling a bait and switch; just because they couldn't find a vein in the fucker doesn't mean shit about the pro's/con's of the death penalty - it just means dude's got fuckin weird veins.
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Admittedly, my post was bait, trying to provoke debate. But as with the article I referred to, I didn't draw a direct link between the two other than that incidents like this raise the larger issue again into the focus of the media and the public.
 
hellblazer said:
nothing stops a would-be murderer more than knowing they will pay the ultimate price for their evil. it's an incredibly effective deterrent.
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No, it's not. Not even close. States with the death penalty have a murder rate almost twice that of states that don't. Why? Because people committing murder do it for one of three reasons.

Compulsion - Serial killers, child rapists, etc. These people are crazy. No deterrent will ever work.
Passion - You catch your wife in bed with another guy, now they gotta go. No chance you could ever deter people who kill out of passion
Profit - Organized crime, etc. Done rationally by people who don't think they will get caught, can't be deterred.

None of those reasons are effected at all by the chance of a death penalty.

Now for the ultimate mindfuck paradox. If you support the death penalty and killing an innocent person is murder, once a single innocent person is executed then you become a murder and deserve the death penalty yourself.
 
turbolapp said:
Actually that's two different things that I will never understand about conservatives. 1) exactly what shady said. 2) That only their god can decide who lives or dies except when humans want to make exceptions to this to please their own desire for blood lust...and then they get to decide.

And to quote shady, make up your mind foo.
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I already debunked this sad misrepresentation. Are both you and Shady pretending you didn't see my response?
 
bb_wolfe said:
Don't ditch the death penalty.

Allow it only in cases of guilty pleas and DNA matched evidence that's indisputable only.

Ditch Lethal Injection. You wanna do a job, do it right... (you'll see it!)

Electric-Chair.jpg
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Meh, it'd be so much easier, and definite surefire of a kill, if you stand a guy above a grate, and release a 2 inch iron slab that covers the room from corner to corner on top of him. And far as disposal? Grate is over a crematorium furnace, spray down, cover grate, and fire it up. Cept lets only do it when you start to smell something, can save some energy that way.
 
hellblazer said:
I already debunked this sad misrepresentation. Are both you and Shady pretending you didn't see my response?
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I havent said jack shit towards you since your response. But if you insist.
hellblazer said:
you're totally confused. my original post was how the OP made a HUGE leap in logic:

botched execution = death penalty bad

xmcp thought i was saying something about the efficacy of the government, so i played along. but here's the truth:

we need the death penalty. nothing stops a would-be murderer more than knowing they will pay the ultimate price for their evil. it's an incredibly effective deterrent.
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Already debunked earlier in the thread. But either way, if you doubt the effectiveness of the government, that doesn't affect anything. They're still incompetent enough to get the wrong man.
but the people that piss and moan about the wrong people getting convicted/executed don't really have a problem with the death penalty - they have a problem with the conviction process.
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Yes I do. I separately have an issue with the death penalty as well, but my primary problem is with the conviction process.
so fix the conviction process. the death penalty issue is a moral decision everyone has to make for themselves. if enough americans want it, eventually it'll make its way through the courts.
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Yeah. Fix the conviction process to get it to 100% accuracy? Good fucking luck without a police state.
I've got a server with a ping of 0 to sell you as well. It's just that optimized.
but my original point is that the OP is pulling a bait and switch; just because they couldn't find a vein in the fucker doesn't mean shit about the pro's/con's of the death penalty - it just means dude's got fuckin weird veins.
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As much as it pains me, I'll agree with this. While there are problems with the death penalty, them fucking it up from time to time isn't really one of them.
 
LazyHippy said:
I think half the point is that it's not a pleasant, humane way to die.

This is a really interesting documentary, especially the experiments with nitrogen asphyxiation... and the views of some of the people they filmed.

How to Kill a Human Being
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This is a fascinating documentary, thanks for posting it. Really opened up my eyes. The worst part is when you see him slowly turn into a vegetable from hypoxia in the fake cockpit.
 
xmcp123 said:
I havent said jack shit towards you since your response. But if you insist.

Already debunked earlier in the thread. But either way, if you doubt the effectiveness of the government, that doesn't affect anything. They're still incompetent enough to get the wrong man.

Yes I do. I separately have an issue with the death penalty as well, but my primary problem is with the conviction process.

Yeah. Fix the conviction process to get it to 100% accuracy? Good fucking luck without a police state.
I've got a server with a ping of 0 to sell you as well. It's just that optimized.

As much as it pains me, I'll agree with this. While there are problems with the death penalty, them fucking it up from time to time isn't really one of them.
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.....You are so hard to put in a box - it's refreshing.....
 
xmcp123 said:
I havent said jack shit towards you since your response. But if you insist.
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I don't insist on anything. I could honestly have given a fuck if you said anything. I only mentioned something because it was getting pathetic watching your sycophants orgasming over a bad point I disproved ten posts earlier.

xmcp123 said:
Already debunked earlier in the thread. But either way, if you doubt the effectiveness of the government, that doesn't affect anything. They're still incompetent enough to get the wrong man.
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The fact that the death penalty is a deterrent was not disproven at all. The only reasons the accumulative nationwide stats point the other way is because you have huge outliers affecting them. For example:

Murder rate per 100,000 people

2006

Texas(Death Penalty) - 5.9
Virginia(Death Penalty) - 5.2
Maryland(No Death Penalty) - 9.7

2007

Texas(Death Penalty) - 5.9
Virginia(Death Penalty) - 5.3
Maryland(No Death Penalty) - 9.8

xmcp123 said:
Yes I do. I separately have an issue with the death penalty as well, but my primary problem is with the conviction process.

Yeah. Fix the conviction process to get it to 100% accuracy? Good fucking luck without a police state.
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This is possibly the best argument I've heard for abolishing the death penalty. No court system can ever possibly convict with total 100% accuracy, so in order to never execute one innocent man, we should never execute anyone at all! Because we have no faith in the system at all!

And because an innocent person could accidentally be killed during war, we should never fight! And because an innocent bystander could accidentally be killed during a shootout between cops and criminals, police shouldn't be allowed to shoot!
 
More info on this debate:

Murder Rates 1996 - 2007 | Death Penalty Information Center

I think the table ordered by rank is the most interesting. Have no time to do some informative graphs out of this right now, but I think it is pretty obvious that a death penalty does not keep anyone from murder.
(Neither does having no death penalty, but you don't run the risk of killing an innocent man)

::emp::
 
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